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 Post subject: Anyone interested in what is wrong with education?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 6:32 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Anyone interested in what is wrong with education?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 9:38 pm 
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Sounds about right. I can't disagree with any of her comments.

Also, in Pennsylvania, it is (or was- can't comment if that has changed in the past year or so) possible to earn more as a tollbooth worker than as an elementary school teacher. Why would anyone want to put up with what teachers put up with for that money?

Of course, here in California my wife can't get a job as a teacher because school budgets have been slashed and layoffs are occurring each year, increasing class sizes and making things worse.

But did anyone see the FL lawmaker who wanted to pass a bill giving teachers the ability to grade parents based on their child's performance, wellbeing, and whether the parent was involved? Now there's an idea...that parents might actually play a role in the education of their child...


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 Post subject: Re: Anyone interested in what is wrong with education?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 11:28 pm 
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Can't stand the supervisors who say, "well, it is the teacher's job to motivate".

What world is he living on?

Teacher's job is to teach. They can do it at $1000 per student in a two room school house, or with a 6-1 ratio and indefinite resources.

Or, they can fail in the same.

The kid's have got to want to learn, or at least be respectful enough of authority to allow the classroom to be calm enough to teach.

Anything less than that falls on the parents and family.

ZM

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 Post subject: Re: Anyone interested in what is wrong with education?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 12:19 am 
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BBF wrote:
Sounds about right. I can't disagree with any of her comments.

Also, in Pennsylvania, it is (or was- can't comment if that has changed in the past year or so) possible to earn more as a tollbooth worker than as an elementary school teacher. Why would anyone want to put up with what teachers put up with for that money?

Of course, here in California my wife can't get a job as a teacher because school budgets have been slashed and layoffs are occurring each year, increasing class sizes and making things worse.

But did anyone see the FL lawmaker who wanted to pass a bill giving teachers the ability to grade parents based on their child's performance, wellbeing, and whether the parent was involved? Now there's an idea...that parents might actually play a role in the education of their child...


When I went off to college in the fall of 1999, the state has just raised it standards for education majors...The GPA minimum was 2.5 and jumped it to 3.0 and then had it set to raise it to 3.15 by 2003, for a job that starts you off with no benefits, low pay, and trying to impress the faculty and school board to get a long term contract...

I was an education major and was doing pretty well, but when I transferred I lost my grandfather clause and unable to finish my education degree with my 2.8 GPA...I went into History and political science and burnt myself out...

Kids are so spoiled today it's not funny at all...

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 Post subject: Re: Anyone interested in what is wrong with education?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 12:25 pm 
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Location: Wheeling, WV
As a retired classroom teacher with 34 years service and now seven years as a substitute teacher, I believe that I bring a unique perspective.

1.The public places demands on teachers that are unrealistic when accountability for instruction is job one. There are simply too many demands which distract from kids and their learning. First thing to change is this crazy expectations game.

2.Moms and dads fit into two catagories. They either are engaged in their kids education or ignore it feeling it's not their job. It's easy to see the results by being around kids for awhile. If we want improved learning we must have improved efforts from mom and or dad. This is complicated by the fact that many kids now come from single parent families and moms almost universally work so that there is much less time and energy to devote to their kids education. But the public in general thinks teachers are lazy and don't care and if that changed all would be well with schools.

3.Classrooms once much larger in number of students were very successful but that changed over a couple of generations. So classroom teachers had fewer kids but gradually a much broader list of responsibilities (drug education,citize.nship,motivation,life skills, etc) simply dumped on their backs. Unfortunately we find ourselves today cutting back on funding for education which is resulting in ever increasing numbers in the classroom and reduction of help in the form of aids and special needs teachers. The relm of responsibilities outside subject matter only increases and people think it's a good idea to continue this trend cuz we're broke.

4.Basic delivery of information to kids is changing as fast as technology is changing(and that is faster than ever). Rooms now have moved to white boards and power point presentations by both teachers and students. Soon, every kid will have a notebook computer at his learning station. Well, that cost money but in the long term reduces cost because expensive textbooks are going the way of the newspaper and land phone.

5.Those changes are raising the question of what we teach. Will the reading of long essays and writing of term papers vanish as important tools of learning? Has spelling, syntex, basic sentence structure decreased in need with word processing and automatic spell check? How about cursive writing in this print driven new world? I thinking that as we move into this brave new world, we better be prepared to adjust to the needs of those kids. There are revolutionary changes taking place now that will only continue and success will go to those who can master the changes.

If you stayed with me though this posting, let me say I'm sorry for it's lebgth.

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 Post subject: Re: Anyone interested in what is wrong with education?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 1:42 pm 
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Substitute2 wrote:
5.Those changes are raising the question of what we teach. Will the reading of long essays and writing of term papers vanish as important tools of learning? Has spelling, syntex, basic sentence structure decreased in need with word processing and automatic spell check? How about cursive writing in this print driven new world? I thinking that as we move into this brave new world, we better be prepared to adjust to the needs of those kids. There are revolutionary changes taking place now that will only continue and success will go to those who can master the changes.


You make some valid points. But as one who made his living working with the written word, I'm bound to tell you that the skills enumerated above already are largely gone. Just look at this message board, which is full of intelligent, well-intentioned people whose use of language -- frankly -- is woeful. As some of you know, I was a newspaper editor. Before I retired two years ago, I often had to train young staffers fresh out of some of the most prestigious universities (yes, even Harvard) who couldn't write to save their lives. Subjects and predicates didn't agree. Tenses didn't agree. Spelling was atrocious. Sentence structure was whatever felt good at the moment. Punctuation: Who needed it? Worst of all, no one had taught them to go back and reread what they'd written before submitting it; they thought it was fine just the way it was.

I despair to think how we recover, especially in the current educational climate.

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 Post subject: Re: Anyone interested in what is wrong with education?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 9:34 pm 
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Quote:
1.The public places demands on teachers that are unrealistic when accountability for instruction is job one. There are simply too many demands which distract from kids and their learning. First thing to change is this crazy expectations game.
Since there is not clapping smilie... :)

Quote:
2.Moms and dads fit into two catagories. They either are engaged in their kids education or ignore it feeling it's not their job. It's easy to see the results by being around kids for awhile. If we want improved learning we must have improved efforts from mom and or dad. This is complicated by the fact that many kids now come from single parent families and moms almost universally work so that there is much less time and energy to devote to their kids education. But the public in general thinks teachers are lazy and don't care and if that changed all would be well with schools.
:)


Quote:
3.Classrooms once much larger in number of students were very successful but that changed over a couple of generations. So classroom teachers had fewer kids but gradually a much broader list of responsibilities (drug education,citize.nship,motivation,life skills, etc) simply dumped on their backs. Unfortunately we find ourselves today cutting back on funding for education which is resulting in ever increasing numbers in the classroom and reduction of help in the form of aids and special needs teachers. The relm of responsibilities outside subject matter only increases and people think it's a good idea to continue this trend cuz we're broke.
Well, not quite so much. Nobody thinks its a good idea because we're broke. It is reality because we are broke.

Quote:
4.Basic delivery of information to kids is changing as fast as technology is changing(and that is faster than ever). Rooms now have moved to white boards and power point presentations by both teachers and students. Soon, every kid will have a notebook computer at his learning station. Well, that cost money but in the long term reduces cost because expensive textbooks are going the way of the newspaper and land phone.
;)

Quote:
5.Those changes are raising the question of what we teach. Will the reading of long essays and writing of term papers vanish as important tools of learning? Has spelling, syntex, basic sentence structure decreased in need with word processing and automatic spell check? How about cursive writing in this print driven new world? I thinking that as we move into this brave new world, we better be prepared to adjust to the needs of those kids. There are revolutionary changes taking place now that will only continue and success will go to those who can master the changes.
;)

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