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 Post subject: Re: Typical BS comments
PostPosted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 1:35 am 
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Piratefan13 wrote:
Wilton, wouldn't that put teams like the Yankees, Red Sox, and Cubs in a position to get the best talent every year? There would be mass closings of teams. Eventually, we'd have 4 teams in each league. The draft is the only method in modern baseball that smaller market teams cans succeed.

I'm not saying that the draft is a terrible thing (although Sheehan appears to). I'm saying that the draft is an unfair system to new players, and I do not begrudge players for trying to subvert the process in order to receive fair market value. I imagine you would too, given your apparent love for capitalism.

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 Post subject: Re: Typical BS comments
PostPosted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 1:36 am 
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You know what an interesting observation about the Yankees is? Every since they started blowing up the payroll into the 9 figures that it is, they haven't won. Yes, they have made it to the playoffs and even the World Series, but they haven't won the big one. When they had their success (96 and 98-00) it was mostly with homegrown players (Jeter, Posada, Rivera, Pettite) and valuable, but cheap role players (Paul O'Neill, Scott Brosius, Chuck Knoblaugh). When they signed Giambi and Mussina and A-Rod and Damon...they just haven't been THE elite team. It amazes me that Cashman actually has his job still. They are proof positive that money alone doesn't buy you a championship.


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 Post subject: Re: Typical BS comments
PostPosted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 1:51 am 
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bucco boy wrote:
The draft exists in every professional sport. You could easily argue all of these guys should get the rookie minimums with no signing bonuses until they prove themselves professionally. The leagues are privately run entities and the drafts are determined by CBAs.

Yes, but the potential draftees are not parties to the CBAs. The Players Association only cares about its current members, not its future members; they could care less about what happens to draftees as long as their current members are happy.

Just because a draft exists in every sport does not mean it is the right system to have. "Everybody's doing it" is not a legitimate justification to me.

As for the argument that "all of these guys should get the rookie minimums with no signing bonuses until they prove themselves professionally," that sounds very Marxist to me. Should that be the way all industries are run? Should my credentials in law school and in undergrad have no bearing on whether I get a high-paying job or a low-paying job, even though I haven't proven myself professionally? That argument basically says that employers should not have to compete for the best potential employees that are new to the marketplace.

Just like Sheehan says, if someone told me that in my first job out of law school I had to work as a contract lawyer for a personal injury firm in Ashtabula, OH, you can be damn sure I'd be a bitch about salary.

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 Post subject: Re: Typical BS comments
PostPosted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 8:49 am 
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Willton wrote:
Just like Sheehan says, if someone told me that in my first job out of law school I had to work as a contract lawyer for a personal injury firm in Ashtabula, OH, you can be damn sure I'd be a bitch about salary.


Apparently, Joe Sheehan has never looked at the medical profession. For those that don't know, once you complete medical school, you enter a process colloquially know as "The Match". At this point, you have interviewed at several residency programs, and you submit a rank list and each residency program submits a rank list of all the candidates they interviewed. All this goes into a computer, which is weighted extremely in favor of residency programs over applicants, and it spits out a match for every person. Thus, if you are ranked #1 by a program, even if they are #5 or lower on your list, that is where you Match. Then, on Match Day, you find out what city you are going to spend the next 4-7 years working in. There are NO salary or benefit negotiations, and there are, I believe, legal consequences to breaking a match (at the very least, if you break a match, you can't go to another program, you have to sit out a year).

I guess the one benefit to this process as compared to the draft is that if you REALLY hate a program, you just don't rank it (I wonder how many players would not rank the Pirates?). Of course, that's a risk, because if they are the only one to rank you high enough for you to get a slot in the program, you end up missing out. But in many ways it is similar to the draft in that once you submit your rankings, you have no say over who your employer will be. AND there are no contract negotiations.


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 Post subject: Re: Typical BS comments
PostPosted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 9:24 am 
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BBF wrote:
AND there are no contract negotiations.



"Hmmmmm! I don't understand this sentence. Let me think on it a bit"

Image



"Darcy, get me BBF's number, pronto!!!!"

Image


..............20 years later we find BBF MD. and his lovely wife enjoying yet another wonderful day in the life...........

Image


..........while Argentum gets on with his...............


Image


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 Post subject: Re: Typical BS comments
PostPosted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 11:11 am 
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BBF wrote:
Willton wrote:
Just like Sheehan says, if someone told me that in my first job out of law school I had to work as a contract lawyer for a personal injury firm in Ashtabula, OH, you can be damn sure I'd be a bitch about salary.


Apparently, Joe Sheehan has never looked at the medical profession. For those that don't know, once you complete medical school, you enter a process colloquially know as "The Match". At this point, you have interviewed at several residency programs, and you submit a rank list and each residency program submits a rank list of all the candidates they interviewed. All this goes into a computer, which is weighted extremely in favor of residency programs over applicants, and it spits out a match for every person. Thus, if you are ranked #1 by a program, even if they are #5 or lower on your list, that is where you Match. Then, on Match Day, you find out what city you are going to spend the next 4-7 years working in. There are NO salary or benefit negotiations, and there are, I believe, legal consequences to breaking a match (at the very least, if you break a match, you can't go to another program, you have to sit out a year).

I guess the one benefit to this process as compared to the draft is that if you REALLY hate a program, you just don't rank it (I wonder how many players would not rank the Pirates?). Of course, that's a risk, because if they are the only one to rank you high enough for you to get a slot in the program, you end up missing out. But in many ways it is similar to the draft in that once you submit your rankings, you have no say over who your employer will be. AND there are no contract negotiations.

Hmm, if that's the case, I wonder if "The Match" has received any antitrust scrutiny. At least MLB can hide behind it's antitrust exemption; I'm not sure the medical profession has such a luxury.

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"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong."
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 Post subject: Re: Typical BS comments
PostPosted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 11:38 am 
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Willton wrote:
Hmm, if that's the case, I wonder if "The Match" has received any antitrust scrutiny. At least MLB can hide behind it's antitrust exemption; I'm not sure the medical profession has such a luxury.


Again, I am not the person to ask because I have been away from med school for 4 years now trying to get a PhD, but I remember there was a group suing the organization running the match, saying that it favored institutions over applicants, but also that it kept resident pay and benefits artificially low. There was an outcry against that group, though, to the effect that residents are a major part of academic medicine, and if wages were to rise then the cost of health care would rise so how dare people want to change that.

I know they said they would change the match to strike more of a balance between individuals' and programs' rank lists, but I don't know if that has been enacted. Either way, having a wife who is certified to teach in the state of PA, along with family nearby, I live in fear of being "forced" to move to Detroit or some wasteland for 4 years. Especially if I finish my PhD in the next few months, I would be matching in 2011...and leaving Pittsburgh just when the baseball is gettin' good.


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