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 Post subject: Another take on McCutchen, Olendorff and Karstens
PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 12:33 pm 
Keith Law of ESPN.com is on ESPN Radio right now talking about the Nady trade.

He said it was a decent trade for the Pirates because Nady/Marte won't be a part of the next winning Pirates team.

He was lukewarm on what the team got back. He said that while the Pirates project Olendorff as a starter, he's probably going to be an 8th inning type of guy in the long run.

He projected McCutchen as a No. 4 starter. He projected Karstans as a long man, though says he could do better in the rotation in the short-term than JVB or Herrera. Missed his take on Tabata.

It's the opinion of another guy who makes his living analyzing baseball (and a former assistan GM with Toronto). Take it for what it's worth.


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 Post subject: Re: Another take on McCutchen, Olendorff and Karstens
PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 1:08 pm 
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Well, I now know its a big win for the Pirates. Getting Keith Law to say ANYTHING positive about the Pirates is akin to getting Nancy Pelosi to say anything positive about GW Bush.

ZM

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 Post subject: Re: Another take on McCutchen, Olendorff and Karstens
PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 1:42 pm 
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"Decent" is far better than what his contemporaries were originally reporting.


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 Post subject: Re: Another take on McCutchen, Olendorff and Karstens
PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 3:21 pm 
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Hi Fellas - long time!

I live in Indy and was able to watch McCutchen pitch against Syracuse last Sunday. He went 6 innings and gave up 4 runs. 2 of those runs came on a cheap 1st inning homer that flew out of the Vic right field corner a whooping 325'. He gave up a ligit hard single with a man on second to score the third run. The 4th run came on a double with a man on 1st and two gone. This runner was a dead duck but The other McCutchen in CF badly missed the cut off man and that was the story.

All in all it was not a bad outing for the new Pirate pitcher. The most disturbing thing is that He gets a lot of fly ball outs. Lots of fly balls is not necessarly a good thing. Here is a link to the box score.

http://indianapolis.indians.milb.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?sid=t484&gid=2008_07_27_syraaa_indaaa_1&cid=484&t=g_box

BTW--- You have to check out who got the save in that game. The stadium radar gun had him at 95mph.


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 Post subject: Re: Another take on McCutchen, Olendorff and Karstens
PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 3:29 pm 
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Fly ball pitcher is fine in PNC. At least, not any particular deteriment.

ZM

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Someone tell Votto... rbis are good


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 Post subject: Re: Another take on McCutchen, Olendorff and Karstens
PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 3:38 pm 
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Does the guy at least throw strikes... thats all we need right now.


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 Post subject: Re: Another take on McCutchen, Olendorff and Karstens
PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 4:08 pm 
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That seems to be a strength with all three pitchers, according to Russell.

ZM

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Someone tell Votto... rbis are good


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 Post subject: Re: Another take on McCutchen, Olendorff and Karstens
PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 5:44 pm 
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Quote:
Does the guy at least throw strikes... thats all we need right now.


6 innings----93 pitches----69 strikes-----3 k's-----2 BB


Jonah Bayliss closed for syracuse. He blew Bixler away in the ninth. Bixler looked bad at the plate all day. He's hitting .278 in Indy. in 200 plate appearances he has struck out 70 times. This is the best Pirate infielder in the minors? Yikes!


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 Post subject: Re: Another take on McCutchen, Olendorff and Karstens
PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 6:31 pm 
Steelkings wrote:
Quote:
Does the guy at least throw strikes... thats all we need right now.


6 innings----93 pitches----69 strikes-----3 k's-----2 BB


Jonah Bayliss closed for syracuse. He blew Bixler away in the ninth. Bixler looked bad at the plate all day. He's hitting .278 in Indy. in 200 plate appearances he has struck out 70 times. This is the best Pirate infielder in the minors? Yikes!


I believe Bixler is simply a bad baseball player.


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 Post subject: Re: Another take on McCutchen, Olendorff and Karstens
PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 8:14 pm 
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Steelkings wrote:
All in all it was not a bad outing for the new Pirate pitcher. The most disturbing thing is that He gets a lot of fly ball outs. Lots of fly balls is not necessarly a good thing.


SK - long time, no post!! Glad to have you back.

Fly ball pitchers are generally power pitches who work fastballs up in the zone to get outs. Fly ball pitchers currently in the majors include Edwin Jackson, Justin Verlander, Gavin Floyd, Cole Hamels, John Maine, Josh Beckett, Eric Bedard, Johnny Cueto, Ervin Santana, Dice-K, Jered Weaver, Oliver Perez and Matt Cain.

All those guys record more outs via fly balls than ground balls, but have had good success. (And keep in mind that for stat purposes, a pop-up is a "fly out." Pop-ups have the lowest success rate of any ball put in play, so giving up pop-ups is not a bad thing.)

The key is minimizing walks, and avoiding giving up HR's. McCutchen seems to do the former, is working on the latter.


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 Post subject: Re: Another take on McCutchen, Olendorff and Karstens
PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2008 8:18 pm 
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More "fly ball" pitchers: Rich Harden, Scott Kazmir.


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 Post subject: Re: Another take on McCutchen, Olendorff and Karstens
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 9:06 am 
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Quote:
SK - long time, no post!! Glad to have you back.


Thanks! I'm sure we will all be talking Steeler football as usual just about 3 days after the trading deadline. With that said, Purhaps I was wrong in thinking that when the Buc's brought up Bixler, we were watching the last of Jack Wilson in Pittsburgh.

Quote:
Fly ball pitchers currently in the majors include Edwin Jackson, Justin Verlander, Gavin Floyd, Cole Hamels, John Maine, Josh Beckett, Eric Bedard, Johnny Cueto, Ervin Santana, Dice-K, Jered Weaver, Oliver Perez and Matt Cain.


Most of the pitchers mentioned above are big time strike out guys too. Based on the one game I saw, I'm not sure that McCutchen fits that bill. I think his biggest up-side is the fact that he gets ahead of the hitters and makes them hit what he wants them to. He is not going to over power guys like a Josh Beckett does. Then again not many guys do.
Mc-pitch is only 25 and is only in the minor league system for 3 years now. He has a ways to go. At this point I think once MLB hitters get used to his odd delivery they will treat mc-Pitch like Charlie Brown. However, when he gets a little stronger and a little more familier with the hitters, he could be as good as a younger Matt Morris.

Is using the name Matt Morris still banned on this site?


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 Post subject: Re: Another take on McCutchen, Olendorff and Karstens
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 10:41 am 
Steelkings wrote:
Quote:
SK - long time, no post!! Glad to have you back.


Thanks! I'm sure we will all be talking Steeler football as usual just about 3 days after the trading deadline. With that said, Purhaps I was wrong in thinking that when the Buc's brought up Bixler, we were watching the last of Jack Wilson in Pittsburgh.

Quote:
Fly ball pitchers currently in the majors include Edwin Jackson, Justin Verlander, Gavin Floyd, Cole Hamels, John Maine, Josh Beckett, Eric Bedard, Johnny Cueto, Ervin Santana, Dice-K, Jered Weaver, Oliver Perez and Matt Cain.


Most of the pitchers mentioned above are big time strike out guys too. Based on the one game I saw, I'm not sure that McCutchen fits that bill. I think his biggest up-side is the fact that he gets ahead of the hitters and makes them hit what he wants them to. He is not going to over power guys like a Josh Beckett does. Then again not many guys do.
Mc-pitch is only 25 and is only in the minor league system for 3 years now. He has a ways to go. At this point I think once MLB hitters get used to his odd delivery they will treat mc-Pitch like Charlie Brown. However, when he gets a little stronger and a little more familier with the hitters, he could be as good as a younger Matt Morris.

Is using the name Matt Morris still banned on this site?


You said a "younger" Matt Morris so you're fine.


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 Post subject: Re: Another take on McCutchen, Olendorff and Karstens
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 10:58 am 
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Elmer wrote:
You said a "younger" Matt Morris so you're fine.

Sure. The younger Matt Morris was good enough to get the guaranteed contract that the Pirates are still paying.


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