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 Post subject: Re: Probably not the first time.... (first post)
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 12:36 am 
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Willton wrote:
No. 9 wrote:
Willton wrote:
News flash: judges are rarely persuaded by oral argument. They usually are ready to rule upon reading the papers.


And those judges are absolutely doing a disservice to the litigants and to their representation.

Are they? If a party can't make a persuasive argument in its brief, what is the likelihood that oral argument will suddenly sway the judge? I realize that it happens, but usually cases are won on the papers (barring a trial, that is).

I see oral argument as a way to clear up any questions the judge may have. It's not terribly useful as an avenue for presenting the merits of the case; that should have been done in the briefs.


If the judge's mind is made up, then he/she should simply rule in writing. Oral argument should be granted if and only the judge's mind remains open. Judges who grant oral argument and waste attorney time and their clients' money are - without question - doing a disservice to the litigants and their attorneys. Further, any judge who presides over argument when his/her mind is made up is - IMO - a lousy jurist.

I see it mainly in state courts where this happens. In federal courts, with few exceptions, argument will be granted in only the rarest of occassions and only when the federal judge remains open to a particular position and wants clarification on the issues.

If you are ready to rule based upon the written submissions, grow a pair and rule on the written submissions and don't force counsel to participate in a charade.

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 Post subject: Re: Probably not the first time.... (first post)
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 4:27 am 
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SpankysGhost wrote:
First off, I'm absolutely sure that I have about 1% the baseball knowledge that most of you that post regularly have. I'll also admit that I'm a bit of a pessimist in regards to the buccos, but I'm not going to complain. I think that they're beginning to lay the ground work for some future positivity. But, I digress...

What I wanted to ask was lets say that theoretically 75% of the moves that have been made or will be made over the next year or so pan out and the Pirates become a contender or at least a winner. Do you think the organization will pay enough to keep their talent, or do they become a feeder to the top spenders? (hopefully continuing to fill the gaps from the minors or cheap(er) vets via free agency).

Here comes the "Probably not the first time.." bit, 3 out of the 4 major sports in this country have caps. I realize that the first answer will be that smart teams win pennants, not always the biggest spenders. I can't deny that, (I could use European league soccer to argue that the big (smart) spenders pretty much win every year, but I won't), if the Pirates continue to build from within per se, I'd hate to see the next Barry Bonds come through the ranks and then skip town for the big money. And then pretty much get that type of punch in the face year after year. Can a cap actually work in MLB? Is there an alternative?



If 75 % of the moves pan out, i am sure NH will be more than happy with that result.
Which 25 don't work out would be the ones to be scared of. Is Pedro part of the 1 or the 3 moves that flames out?.
Does Rich Dubee work out?, if he does, chalk that up to a minor miracle, good scouting, and just plain dumb luck.
On the other hand , if Pedro is a bust, that is a combination of bad scouting, bad advice, and again, plain dumb luck, which this organization has had more than it's share of in the last 17(and going strong) seasons.
This team should be built to win at a 50%, or higher rate by 2011 , at the earliest.
Curious to see how it plays out, but all the UPSIDE players that NH has acquired in his Big Trades of 2008 and 09, should be major core parts of the Pirates, or just about ready for their first sniff of major league action.

Oh BTW, welcome aboard, Sailor.


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 Post subject: Re: Probably not the first time.... (first post)
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 4:42 am 
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Bucfan wrote:
urbanexplorer wrote:
I totally agree. MLB needs to make some changes someday...
Damn players union is too strong.

You know who bears responsibility for the current make-up of MLB's salary inequities?

Supreme Court nominee Sotomayor, who ordered that the lock-out end, right when players had begun to cross the picket line and the Union was on the verge of giving in to a hard salary cap. This site notes the timing of Sotomayor's order, preventing the lockout from continuing, but I recall more than this.

http://crooksandliars.com/john-amato/sotomayor-and-mlb

I recall the Union beginning to falter on this issue, whem teams put teams with replacment players on the field in spring training (including guys like Keith Osik).



The way you portray this event, is that Taco Bell was solely responsible for this lockout ending.
You honestly believe that she had that much power,presiding over such a big case, back in 1994 ?
She was more of a sacrifical lamb, a shield.

What she did have was alot of backup, aka, the NY supreme Court , in case things turned ugly, and the owners would somehow not abide by the ruling.
El Grande got the headlines as THE ONE, but she was more of a puppet than anything. It just happened to work in her favor, the Supreme Court of New York, and the union's.


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 Post subject: Re: Probably not the first time.... (first post)
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 10:38 am 
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palushock wrote:
Bucfan wrote:
urbanexplorer wrote:
I totally agree. MLB needs to make some changes someday...
Damn players union is too strong.

You know who bears responsibility for the current make-up of MLB's salary inequities?

Supreme Court nominee Sotomayor, who ordered that the lock-out end, right when players had begun to cross the picket line and the Union was on the verge of giving in to a hard salary cap. This site notes the timing of Sotomayor's order, preventing the lockout from continuing, but I recall more than this.

http://crooksandliars.com/john-amato/sotomayor-and-mlb

I recall the Union beginning to falter on this issue, whem teams put teams with replacment players on the field in spring training (including guys like Keith Osik).



The way you portray this event, is that Taco Bell was solely responsible for this lockout ending.
You honestly believe that she had that much power,presiding over such a big case, back in 1994 ?
She was more of a sacrifical lamb, a shield.

What she did have was alot of backup, aka, the NY supreme Court , in case things turned ugly, and the owners would somehow not abide by the ruling.
El Grande got the headlines as THE ONE, but she was more of a puppet than anything. It just happened to work in her favor, the Supreme Court of New York, and the union's.

Labor issues like this one are federal issues, not state issues. The NY Court of Appeals (which is the highest court in NY; the NY Supreme Court is the trial court of NY) and the State of NY in general had no interest in this case.

By the way, calling an excellent Hispanic jurist like Sotomayor "Taco Bell" is disgusting and deplorable at the highest level. You should be ashamed of yourself.

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 Post subject: Re: Probably not the first time.... (first post)
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 1:20 pm 
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My wife is Hispanic which makes my kids half. Perhaps you would like to let us all know your heritage palu so we can make racist remarks in your direction. Not that I would lower myself to that level however. :evil: What do they say about true colors?


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 Post subject: Re: Probably not the first time.... (first post)
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 1:33 pm 
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Yep.

However, I'm intrigued still by her rather quick and dismissive approach to the settlement. I know Wilton says most decsions are done by paperwork, but that begs the question... why argue in front of a judge? This was an arbitration hearing and I am not sure that a preprared decision is always the way these are done.

Given her public record, I am with Bucfan in that she destroyed the one real chance this league had to develop a meaningful revenue distribution system.

ZM

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 Post subject: Re: Probably not the first time.... (first post)
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 2:18 pm 
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Az Bucco fan wrote:
My wife is Hispanic which makes my kids half. Perhaps you would like to let us all know your heritage palu so we can make racist remarks in your direction. Not that I would lower myself to that level however. :evil: What do they say about true colors?

He's probably white trash, just like most folks who make such racist remarks.

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 Post subject: Re: Probably not the first time.... (first post)
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 2:21 pm 
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Az Bucco fan wrote:
My wife is Hispanic which makes my kids half. Perhaps you would like to let us all know your heritage palu so we can make racist remarks in your direction. Not that I would lower myself to that level however. :evil: What do they say about true colors?



Nothing against Latinos, actually i think most of the women of that nationality are smoking hot.
When people used that Le Grande Le range, or whatever nickname on Rusty Staub, was that a slap at all the people of his nationality?
A little humor now and then is not a bad thing.
I am not ashamed of myself, Wilton, for using that term to describe HER.
I did not intend to hurt your sensitive feelings towards Latinos.
Apparently there will always be members of this board, who entrust them self as do gooders, and must condemn anyone's words they find offensive.
Lighten up, Wilton, go down to your local Turkey Hill and microwave up a tasty burrito.
Take a deep breath, and just relax, and repeat the words, "everyone is not as wise as me"


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 Post subject: Re: Probably not the first time.... (first post)
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 2:25 pm 
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ZelieMike wrote:
Yep.

However, I'm intrigued still by her rather quick and dismissive approach to the settlement. I know Wilton says most decsions are done by paperwork, but that begs the question... why argue in front of a judge? This was an arbitration hearing and I am not sure that a preprared decision is always the way these are done.

Given her public record, I am with Bucfan in that she destroyed the one real chance this league had to develop a meaningful revenue distribution system.

ZM

If this was an arbitration hearing, then why was it before a federal district judge? The Federal Arbitration Act only allows very limited judicial review of arbitration awards. The only thing a federal judge can do is confirm the award or vacate it because it was essentially fraudulently obtained. If this was before Judge Sotomayor, then a decision had already been made by the arbitrator, and there was very little that any bit of oral argument before the judge could have resolved.

As for having a "meaningful revenue distribution system," I still contend that having a cap of any kind would be detrimental to the sport. The fact that MLB's current revenue sharing system invites teams to engage in anticompetitive behavior is enough for me to abhor the whole thing.

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 Post subject: Re: Probably not the first time.... (first post)
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 2:29 pm 
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Palus...Rusty Staub was "Le Grande Orange" due to his hair color...red almost to the point of being orange...and the fact that he played in Montreal...a French Canadian city.

I would suggest...however...that thinking and rereading before one transmits a message is a good thing. Especially when one's tone and meaning can be misunderstood. Would you transmit a message in a professional setting that way (work). If not...maybe you need to consider what you say.


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 Post subject: Re: Probably not the first time.... (first post)
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 2:31 pm 
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palushock wrote:
Az Bucco fan wrote:
My wife is Hispanic which makes my kids half. Perhaps you would like to let us all know your heritage palu so we can make racist remarks in your direction. Not that I would lower myself to that level however. :evil: What do they say about true colors?



Nothing against Latinos, actually i think most of the women of that nationality are smoking hot.
When people used that Le Grande Le range, or whatever nickname on Rusty Staub, was that a slap at all the people of his nationality?
A little humor now and then is not a bad thing.
I am not ashamed of myself, Wilton, for using that term to describe HER.
I did not intend to hurt your sensitive feelings towards Latinos.
Apparently there will always be members of this board, who entrust them self as do gooders, and must condemn anyone's words they find offensive.
Lighten up, Wilton, go down to your local Turkey Hill and microwave up a tasty burrito.

If you're going to use humor, at least make it funny. That's not funny, even if you think racist jokes are funny. Calling Sotomayor "Taco Bell" is lame from a humor standpoint and offensive from a Latino's standpoint. Save your lame humor for the trailer park.

palushock wrote:
Take a deep breath, and just relax, and repeat the words, "everyone is not as wise as me"

Based on reading your comments, that's clearly true.

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 Post subject: Re: Probably not the first time.... (first post)
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 3:11 pm 
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Palus...Rusty Staub was "Le Grande Orange" due to his hair color...red almost to the point of being orange...and the fact that he played in Montreal...a French Canadian city



Oh, i guess than it had nothing to do with his physical appearance what so ever huh?

Lighten up , all you haters of the P man.!!!!!


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 Post subject: Re: Probably not the first time.... (first post)
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 3:32 pm 
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palushock wrote:
Az Bucco fan wrote:
My wife is Hispanic which makes my kids half. Perhaps you would like to let us all know your heritage palu so we can make racist remarks in your direction. Not that I would lower myself to that level however. :evil: What do they say about true colors?



Nothing against Latinos, actually i think most of the women of that nationality are smoking hot.
When people used that Le Grande Le range, or whatever nickname on Rusty Staub, was that a slap at all the people of his nationality?
A little humor now and then is not a bad thing.
I am not ashamed of myself, Wilton, for using that term to describe HER.
I did not intend to hurt your sensitive feelings towards Latinos.
Apparently there will always be members of this board, who entrust them self as do gooders, and must condemn anyone's words they find offensive.
Lighten up, Wilton, go down to your local Turkey Hill and microwave up a tasty burrito.
Take a deep breath, and just relax, and repeat the words, "everyone is not as wise as me"



COME ON ADMINS....IT's TIME TO PULL THE PLUG ON PALUSHOCK. HE BRINGS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING USEFUL TO THE BOARD! THEN HE WANTS TO MAKE ALL KIND OF BLAME FOR BEING LAME.

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 Post subject: Re: Probably not the first time.... (first post)
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 3:34 pm 
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No hate here. If refraining from racial insensitivity makes me a do gooder, then put me down on the list. You won't get too far with a Latina with those types of comments. ;) You make comments like that to my wife, your arse might be up around your ears.


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 Post subject: Re: Probably not the first time.... (first post)
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 3:37 pm 
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Az Bucco fan wrote:
No hate here. If refraining from racial insensitivity makes me a do gooder, then put me down on the list. You won't get too far with a Latina with those types of comments. ;) You make comments like that to my wife, your arse might be up around your ears.


This should be the last straw for him. Admins need to cut him loose. All the guy does is make trouble, made a homosexual remark about me, calling names, and now racial insults?

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 Post subject: Re: Probably not the first time.... (first post)
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 3:38 pm 
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Damn you all. That was 5 minutes I'll never get back.


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 Post subject: Re: Probably not the first time.... (first post)
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 3:45 pm 
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i guess I was wrong. I kinda thought that this section of the board was supposed to deal with baseball. Could we stay to the intended areas please?

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 Post subject: Re: Probably not the first time.... (first post)
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 4:10 pm 
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Substitute2 wrote:
i guess I was wrong. I kinda thought that this section of the board was supposed to deal with baseball. Could we stay to the intended areas please?


It WAS baseball..went off on a bit of a tangent...then went in a completely different direction after palushock made inappropriate racial comments.

I think we need to blame SpankysGhost. Look what he started.

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 Post subject: Re: Probably not the first time.... (first post)
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 4:13 pm 
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Animal wrote:
Az Bucco fan wrote:
No hate here. If refraining from racial insensitivity makes me a do gooder, then put me down on the list. You won't get too far with a Latina with those types of comments. ;) You make comments like that to my wife, your arse might be up around your ears, or at the least, missing your watch and wallet.

This should be the last straw for him. Admins need to cut him loose. All the guy does is make trouble, made a homosexual remark about me, calling names, and now racial insults?

Well, i guess the homo remarks must really strike a nerve. that is just a plain shame.
You forgot to include how i make fun of people who have deceased relatives. Why don't you just stick a gun up you know where, and pull the freaking trigger?, Please, do yourself, and the millions and millions at home, a huge favor.
What a bunch of whining little bitches that are found in this board.
You want to ban me? go ahead and contend to the censors that you actually bring a touch of wisdom, pertaining to this board. I guess calling someone small minded is acceptable by your standards, but calling you a moron, is a reason to have me banished.

I never had a problem with you until you called me small minded. I guess you don't recall that though huh?.
It was you, that was offended when i called JR, small market johnnie, and came back at me with the insult.
Look it up, all you moderators, and see who the real jerk on this site. Here's a good start, just start going through ANIMAL's ludicrous rants, to find your answer.

This guy proposed last week to ignore guys like myself and Ryann, so why is he still putting his 2 cents in?. Apparently my views and comments are too long, and make little sense, that's just too freaking bad.
Whether you agree or not, you fired the first insult, not me.
You are going to call me small minded?, and i am just going to sit here and take it?, don't think so.
Practice what you preach Dude, and don't twist every little thing i say in order to justify yourself.

Grow up Animal, and please, stick to your original idea, and just ignore me, like you proposed to do in the first place. I will never respond to a post made by you again. In reality, your thoughts bring nothing to the table, that i am interested in reading , or debating over.

Your 'chip away bucs' post you started the other day was a must read.

Let the other's figure out who the real Small Minded guy is. Time and time again when you make your foolish statements,they are fictional, not fact.
Are you trying to be another Bob Walk?
Got any Keys to the second half of the season?.
If so, would love to read them, always nice to have a good laugh.

How about agreeing to the same pact concerning me?.
Can you be a man of your word?, i know i am.!


Do we have a DEAL?

Let the question sink in , before you attempt to come back with a reply. I don't want you to go postal, and start fighting everyone at the local laundromat.


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 Post subject: Re: Probably not the first time.... (first post)
PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 4:14 pm 
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palushock wrote:
Palus...Rusty Staub was "Le Grande Orange" due to his hair color...red almost to the point of being orange...and the fact that he played in Montreal...a French Canadian city



Oh, i guess than it had nothing to do with his physical appearance what so ever huh?

No, it had everything to do with his physical appearance. It had nothing to do with his ethnicity.

palushock wrote:
Lighten up , all you haters of the P man.!!!!!

Right, because that's our problem: we should be more tolerant of racism. :roll:

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