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 Post subject: Re: Pirates trade for Hanrahan and Milledge/Lose Morgan/Burnett
PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 8:01 pm 
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Huntingdon made some good points on the radio side.

-Hanrahan's ERA is high, but that is a horrible matrix to judge a reliever on.

-Even though they traded two starters from the OF, they had replacements in place.

-They did double, triple checking on Milledge and their due diligence showed that the issues surrounding him can be overcome.

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 Post subject: Re: Pirates trade for Hanrahan and Milledge/Lose Morgan/Burnett
PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 8:10 pm 
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omgardd wrote:
I knew this board consisted of members from a mirror planet, but c'mon. The Pirates get nothing for Jason Bay, and everybody here considers it a good trade. The Pirates absolutely swindeled the Nats on this one and the trade is panned. I don't get it. Nyjer Morgan is almost 30 is being traded at his absolute peak, in no way is he ever going to get any better than he is right now. Milledge is 23 years old and in the not too distant past, was considered one of the best prospects in the game, all he needs is to mature a little bit, and I think playing with Cutch is gonna do him some good.

Applause Opie.

It must be bittersweet for you, having NH school your pet franchise.

This is an unequivocal win for the Pirates. As short as 3 months ago, Morgan straight-up for Milledge would've been laughably unthinkable. And it'll be interesting to see how Hanrahan performs with a defense that isn't D.C.'s behind him.

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 Post subject: Re: Pirates trade for Hanrahan and Milledge/Lose Morgan/Burnett
PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 8:18 pm 
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LtCol Kojak Slaphead wrote:
omgardd wrote:
I knew this board consisted of members from a mirror planet, but c'mon. The Pirates get nothing for Jason Bay, and everybody here considers it a good trade. The Pirates absolutely swindeled the Nats on this one and the trade is panned. I don't get it. Nyjer Morgan is almost 30 is being traded at his absolute peak, in no way is he ever going to get any better than he is right now. Milledge is 23 years old and in the not too distant past, was considered one of the best prospects in the game, all he needs is to mature a little bit, and I think playing with Cutch is gonna do him some good.

Applause Opie.

It must be bittersweet for you, having NH school your pet franchise.

This is an unequivocal win for the Pirates. As short as 3 months ago, Morgan straight-up for Milledge would've been laughably unthinkable. And it'll be interesting to see how Hanrahan performs with a defense that isn't D.C.'s behind him.


I TOTALLY 100PERCENT Agree with what omgardd said. He is exactly right.

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 Post subject: Re: HORRIBLE HORRIBLE HORRIBLE HORRIBLE HORRIBLE
PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 11:15 pm 
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Animal wrote:
This may be the worst trade he has made. I had no problem trading the others for prospects...but to bring in a guy who is nothing but a cancer is horrible.

For the first time in my life, I am going to boo a Pirate. I WILL NOT cheer for a player such as Milledge.


I agree. I would have rather seen Capps or Grabow go than Burnett if we had to make this trade. The Nats just found there new closer and he should have been our new closer. I'm pissed about this one. We have no idea what we will get out of Milledge, and i don't like him at all.
I don't disagree with trading Nyjer but i don't like getting rid of Burnett.


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 Post subject: Re: Pirates trade for Hanrahan and Milledge/Lose Morgan/Burnett
PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 11:16 pm 
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omgardd wrote:
I knew this board consisted of members from a mirror planet, but c'mon. The Pirates get nothing for Jason Bay, and everybody here considers it a good trade. The Pirates absolutely swindeled the Nats on this one and the trade is panned. I don't get it. Nyjer Morgan is almost 30 is being traded at his absolute peak, in no way is he ever going to get any better than he is right now. Milledge is 23 years old and in the not too distant past, was considered one of the best prospects in the game, all he needs is to mature a little bit, and I think playing with Cutch is gonna do him some good.

Applause Opie.

Don't confuse the gripes of a few members of this board with "everybody here." I, for one, think both trades were well executed, and this one was particularly well done.

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 Post subject: Re: HORRIBLE HORRIBLE HORRIBLE HORRIBLE HORRIBLE
PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 11:17 pm 
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Colin21 wrote:
Animal wrote:
This may be the worst trade he has made. I had no problem trading the others for prospects...but to bring in a guy who is nothing but a cancer is horrible.

For the first time in my life, I am going to boo a Pirate. I WILL NOT cheer for a player such as Milledge.


I agree. I would have rather seen Capps or Grabow go than Burnett if we had to make this trade. The Nats just found there new closer and he should have been our new closer. I'm pissed about this one. We have no idea what we will get out of Milledge, and i don't like him at all.
I don't disagree with trading Nyjer but i don't like getting rid of Burnett.

Burnett as a closer? No, thank you.


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 Post subject: Re: HORRIBLE HORRIBLE HORRIBLE HORRIBLE HORRIBLE
PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 11:21 pm 
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Colin21 wrote:
Animal wrote:
This may be the worst trade he has made. I had no problem trading the others for prospects...but to bring in a guy who is nothing but a cancer is horrible.

For the first time in my life, I am going to boo a Pirate. I WILL NOT cheer for a player such as Milledge.


I agree. I would have rather seen Capps or Grabow go than Burnett if we had to make this trade. The Nats just found there new closer and he should have been our new closer. I'm pissed about this one. We have no idea what we will get out of Milledge, and i don't like him at all.
I don't disagree with trading Nyjer but i don't like getting rid of Burnett.

Oh please. Burnett is a soft tosser who can't strike anybody out. The guy has had 23 strikeouts against 15 BBs in 32 innings and you're sad to see him go? Burnett has been extremely lucky to have such a low ERA (see his .221 BABIP this year). The Bucs could not have sold higher on the guy.

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 Post subject: Re: Pirates trade for Hanrahan and Milledge/Lose Morgan/Burnett
PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 11:31 pm 
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I am not totally against this trade....if you would have kept Milledge out of it.

Everytime I've seen or heard from this guy he is nothing but a classless jerk.....I don't care if he is the second coming of Babe Ruth, talent wise. With is between the ears issues he will always be outperformed by those with lesser talent. He is a cancer that can drag everyone else down with him. Two other teams before have given up on him. I am going to find it very, very, difficult to root for a guy like that until he shows some genuine penance.

I have been critical of a lot of the trades.....and I agree at the age of thirty Morgan had reached his peak. But, I would have pushed for a bit more....perhaps two other guys instead of Milledge.


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 Post subject: Re: HORRIBLE HORRIBLE HORRIBLE HORRIBLE HORRIBLE
PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 11:32 pm 
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Willton wrote:
Colin21 wrote:
Animal wrote:
This may be the worst trade he has made. I had no problem trading the others for prospects...but to bring in a guy who is nothing but a cancer is horrible.

For the first time in my life, I am going to boo a Pirate. I WILL NOT cheer for a player such as Milledge.


I agree. I would have rather seen Capps or Grabow go than Burnett if we had to make this trade. The Nats just found there new closer and he should have been our new closer. I'm pissed about this one. We have no idea what we will get out of Milledge, and i don't like him at all.
I don't disagree with trading Nyjer but i don't like getting rid of Burnett.

Oh please. Burnett is a soft tosser who can't strike anybody out. The guy has had 23 strikeouts against 15 BBs in 32 innings and you're sad to see him go? Burnett has been extremely lucky to have such a low ERA (see his .221 BABIP this year). The Bucs could not have sold higher on the guy.


Burnett currently has better numbers than Brian Fuentes and he leads the major leagues in saves right now. Yes Burnett does have low strikeout numbers, but there are alot of good closers that aren't "strikeout pitchers".


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 Post subject: Re: Pirates trade for Hanrahan and Milledge/Lose Morgan/Burnett
PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 11:34 pm 
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Steve1118 wrote:
I am not totally against this trade....if you would have kept Milledge out of it.

Everytime I've seen or heard from this guy he is nothing but a classless jerk.....I don't care if he is the second coming of Babe Ruth, talent wise. With is between the ears issues he will always be outperformed by those with lesser talent. He is a cancer that can drag everyone else down with him. Two other teams before have given up on him. I am going to find it very, very, difficult to root for a guy like that until he shows some genuine penance.

I have been critical of a lot of the trades.....and I agree at the age of thirty Morgan had reached his peak. But, I would have pushed for a bit more....perhaps two other guys instead of Milledge.

People once said similar things about Reggie Jackson.

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 Post subject: Re: HORRIBLE HORRIBLE HORRIBLE HORRIBLE HORRIBLE
PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 11:41 pm 
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Colin21 wrote:
Willton wrote:
Oh please. Burnett is a soft tosser who can't strike anybody out. The guy has had 23 strikeouts against 15 BBs in 32 innings and you're sad to see him go? Burnett has been extremely lucky to have such a low ERA (see his .221 BABIP this year). The Bucs could not have sold higher on the guy.


Burnett currently has better numbers than Brian Fuentes and he leads the major leagues in saves right now. Yes Burnett does have low strikeout numbers, but there are alot of good closers that aren't "strikeout pitchers".

No, Burnett does NOT have better numbers than Brian Fuentes. Brian Fuentes has struck out 30 batters in 27 innings while walking only 9 batters during that time. Fuentes' K/BB ratio is twice that of Burnett. The only reason Burnett has a lower ERA than Fuentes does is because Burnett pitches in the NL and has a better defense behind him than Fuentes does. Aside from the fact that they are both southpaws, the two pitchers are incomparable.

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 Post subject: Re: Pirates trade for Hanrahan and Milledge/Lose Morgan/Burnett
PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 11:46 pm 
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Wilton, Jackson wasn't given up on by two teams, nor did he have a history that included earnest discussions with law enforcement officers. The kid has a lot to prove, but talent isn't his weakness. The guy has been trouble everywhere he's been.

The guy has talent, to be sure. But, it takes more than talent. The best part of this deal was the ability to get Jones and Salazar to the big club.

As far as Milledge goes, I would hope the Buccos keep him on a short leash. If he steps out of line....he'd be gone in a heartbeat (if you could find anyone who wants him).


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 Post subject: Re: Pirates trade for Hanrahan and Milledge/Lose Morgan/Burnett
PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 11:49 pm 
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Steve1118 wrote:

As far as Milledge goes, I would hope the Buccos keep him on a short leash. If he steps out of line....he'd be gone in a heartbeat (if you could find anyone who wants him).


I think that's the plan. NH said he has to earn a trip to the Pirates. The Pirates have a lot of OF talent in the org now and the only position that is solid is Cutch. Everyone else is fighting for a slot.

That might be good but we won't know until at least this time next year and probably until the opening day of 2011.

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 Post subject: Re: Pirates trade for Hanrahan and Milledge/Lose Morgan/Burnett
PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 11:53 pm 
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I'm so sick of people (not pointing fingers, just in general) saying they don't want any clubhouse cancers or any bad eggs in the dugout. Why not? We don't have to put up with them. We don't have to deal with ego's. All I care about is cheering for a winning Pirates team in October. Give me a roster with Milton Bradley, Barry Bonds, and any other jerk, but if they are winning I wouldn't be happier. The Pirates have had so many nice-guy losers throughout the years that I think it's our time to sell our soul. I just put mine on eBay...start the bidding.

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 Post subject: Re: Pirates trade for Hanrahan and Milledge/Lose Morgan/Burnett
PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 11:57 pm 
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IA Pirate wrote:
I'm so sick of people (not pointing fingers, just in general) saying they don't want any clubhouse cancers or any bad eggs in the dugout. Why not? We don't have to put up with them. We don't have to deal with ego's. All I care about is cheering for a winning Pirates team in October. Give me a roster with Milton Bradley, Barry Bonds, and any other jerk, but if they are winning I wouldn't be happier. The Pirates have had so many nice-guy losers throughout the years that I think it's our time to sell our soul. I just put mine on eBay...start the bidding.


I just think these "bad eggs" get free passes through life because they are top talent.


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 Post subject: Re: Pirates trade for Hanrahan and Milledge/Lose Morgan/Burnett
PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 11:58 pm 
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Steve1118 wrote:
Wilton, Jackson wasn't given up on by two teams, nor did he have a history that included earnest discussions with law enforcement officers. The kid has a lot to prove, but talent isn't his weakness. The guy has been trouble everywhere he's been.

The guy has talent, to be sure. But, it takes more than talent. The best part of this deal was the ability to get Jones and Salazar to the big club.

As far as Milledge goes, I would hope the Buccos keep him on a short leash. If he steps out of line....he'd be gone in a heartbeat (if you could find anyone who wants him).

What has Milledge done to warrant such a label? When did Milledge get in trouble with the law?

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 Post subject: Re: Pirates trade for Hanrahan and Milledge/Lose Morgan/Burnett
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 12:00 am 
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Colin21 wrote:
IA Pirate wrote:
I'm so sick of people (not pointing fingers, just in general) saying they don't want any clubhouse cancers or any bad eggs in the dugout. Why not? We don't have to put up with them. We don't have to deal with ego's. All I care about is cheering for a winning Pirates team in October. Give me a roster with Milton Bradley, Barry Bonds, and any other jerk, but if they are winning I wouldn't be happier. The Pirates have had so many nice-guy losers throughout the years that I think it's our time to sell our soul. I just put mine on eBay...start the bidding.


I just think these "bad eggs" get free passes through life because they are top talent.

Welcome to the real world.

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 Post subject: Re: Pirates trade for Hanrahan and Milledge/Lose Morgan/Burnett
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 12:34 am 
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Az Bucco fan wrote:
I am ambivalent about this deal.

That is my feeling. Milledge has more talent than Morgan, but Morgan is a guy who will clap teammates on the back and contribute to a positive feeling following a win, even if he did not have a good game. Milledge strikes me as one of those guys who is happy when he goes 2-4 and the team loses, and is bitter if he goes 0-4 and the team wins.

Az Bucco fan wrote:
Hanrahan has some upside and we will see about Milledge. I see Moss going to left and Young getting more time in right. It that all bad? We shall see.

Hanrahan can throw 95 mph, but has limited control and has never succeeded as a closer. Capps scares me sometimes, but he is Dennis freaking Eckersley compared to Hanrahan.


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 Post subject: Re: Pirates trade for Hanrahan and Milledge/Lose Morgan/Burnett
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 12:46 am 
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Bucfan wrote:
Az Bucco fan wrote:
I am ambivalent about this deal.

That is my feeling. Milledge has more talent than Morgan, but Morgan is a guy who will clap teammates on the back and contribute to a positive feeling following a win, even if he did not have a good game. Milledge strikes me as one of those guys who is happy when he goes 2-4 and the team loses, and is bitter if he goes 0-4 and the team wins.

Az Bucco fan wrote:
Hanrahan has some upside and we will see about Milledge. I see Moss going to left and Young getting more time in right. It that all bad? We shall see.

Hanrahan can throw 95 mph, but has limited control and has never succeeded as a closer. Capps scares me sometimes, but he is Dennis freaking Eckersley compared to Hanrahan.


Yeah also Hanrahan is over a year olders than Burnett. I would have been happier if this was a one for one deal with it being Nyjer of Milledge.


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 Post subject: Re: Pirates trade for Hanrahan and Milledge/Lose Morgan/Burnett
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 12:52 am 
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Bucfan wrote:
Az Bucco fan wrote:
Hanrahan has some upside and we will see about Milledge. I see Moss going to left and Young getting more time in right. It that all bad? We shall see.

Hanrahan can throw 95 mph, but has limited control and has never succeeded as a closer. Capps scares me sometimes, but he is Dennis freaking Eckersley compared to Hanrahan.

That's not fair to Hanrahan. Capps would have a 7 ERA too if he had the worst defense in the league behind him. Hanrahan was an excellent buy low candidate; his ERA will drop like a stone when he gets to Pittsburgh.

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