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 Post subject: Re: I got a situation Question
PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 11:44 pm 
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Re: Free Agency Death Compensation.

That is somewhat of an interesting question...if only because of what happened in the NHL last season. If you recall...the Rangers had drafted a young man from Russia...Cherepanov...(17th pick in 1st round) in the 2007 draft. Due to the lack of a transfer agreement...he could not get out of his KHA contract. The Rangers still had the NHL rights to him when he died in October 2008. While not quite the same situation...the NHL did award a compensatory draft choice (17th pick in 2nd round) to the Rangers this season.

I'm guessing that if a compensation level free agent signed with a club...then died, or was injured significantly enough to not be able to play before his contract started the next season...the compensation picks would remain.


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 Post subject: Re: I got a situation Question
PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 11:48 pm 
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Colin21 wrote:
Animal put up links about all his arrests. If that is the case and that is Dukes i feel totally different about this. I was all for getting Milledge before i heard that stuff about him. I still don't really like trading Burnett.

AFAIK, Animal never provided any links even though he was asked to several times.


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 Post subject: Re: I got a situation Question
PostPosted: Tue Jun 30, 2009 11:50 pm 
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burghermeister wrote:
Colin21 wrote:
Animal put up links about all his arrests. If that is the case and that is Dukes i feel totally different about this. I was all for getting Milledge before i heard that stuff about him. I still don't really like trading Burnett.

AFAIK, Animal never provided any links even though he was asked to several times.


He did. Let me go try to find them. There were 3 of them. 2 were back from when he played for the Mets, and i don't remember when the other one was from.


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 Post subject: Re: I got a situation Question
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 1:04 am 
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Colin21 wrote:
He did. Let me go try to find them. There were 3 of them. 2 were back from when he played for the Mets, and i don't remember when the other one was from.

Ok. I'll just wait here then.

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 Post subject: Re: I got a situation Question
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 2:57 am 
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Wait no longer. I found the link Animal posted. They say nothing about the 4 children to 4 different women, but it does talk about him having sex with 12 year olds.

http://www.nydailynews.com/archives/spo ... gs_mi.html
http://www.nypost.com/seven/09212007/sp ... tossed.htm
http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/le ... 52002.html


The reason also i believe that no punishment ever came of this is because of this below. I am sorry to those of you who are police, because i know we have one or 2 on the board.

Quote:
Tony Milledge, who is a Florida Highway Patrol officer, denied his son did anything wrong and said both players were at a practice at the time the incident allegedly occurred


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 Post subject: Re: I got a situation Question
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 11:05 am 
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Colin21 wrote:
Wait no longer. I found the link Animal posted. They say nothing about the 4 children to 4 different women, but it does talk about him having sex with 12 year olds.

Allegedly, my friend, allegedly.

Colin21 wrote:
The reason also i believe that no punishment ever came of this is because of this below. I am sorry to those of you who are police, because i know we have one or 2 on the board.

Quote:
Tony Milledge, who is a Florida Highway Patrol officer, denied his son did anything wrong and said both players were at a practice at the time the incident allegedly occurred

No offense, Colin, but that's a load of crap. Innuendo piled on top of innuendo. You have no idea what really happened and no basis to throw out such accusations. I could just as easily say that, and I am sorry to those of you who have 12 and 13 year old girls, but girls of that age are often petty, vindictive and make shit up. I have no idea if that's what happened here but it's just as likely as Colin's scenario. Speculation can play both ways when the facts are not disclosed.

Look, I'm not defending what Milledge may have done as a 16 year old kid. If he did it, it was reprehensible. But we don't know the details, we don't know if it's true or not and he was never charged with anything. Under those circumstances, I think we need to give the guy the right to move on with his life. And, for the record, I would have said exactly the same thing if he were still a Met. If people don't want him as a Pirate because of what he may have done when he was 16, that's certainly within your rights. But don't throw out scurilous accusations for which you have no proof.

And I'm still waiting for details on the 6 arrests and x children by y mothers.

BM


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 Post subject: Re: I got a situation Question
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 12:24 pm 
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Quote:
I found the link Animal posted. They say nothing about the 4 children to 4 different women, but it does talk about him having sex with 12 year olds.


The funny thing about you saying he was "having sex with 12 year olds" is that you aren't putting into context that he was 16 when these allegations were made. Yeah, that is pushing it, but it's never been proven, and we have no reason to judge the guy. Some of the hate that is thrown at this guy is laughable.
I am also waiting for a single link other than a message board to prove about the 6 arrests/ 4 babies nonsense.
Prove it or shut up about it.


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 Post subject: Re: I got a situation Question
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 1:34 pm 
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Dukes is who animal has been talking about. Yet he has made it seem Milledge is dukes. Lastings isn't that bad of a kid he had sex with 14 year olds when he was 17 not a huge deal. He high fived fans, show up late to 2 team meetings, and didn't get a long in a questionable mets clubhouse.

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 Post subject: WOW!! Lots and Lots of Arguments...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 6:18 pm 
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Well, I have read what I read. I have heard what I have heard. I am not going to apologize for my feelings. I don't believe I have mixed up Milledge and Dukes.

I have seen dozens of websites talking about his personal and professional life. Problems with society, teammates, authority. I know these type of people well. Is it all true? Maybe, maybe not. But certainly, where there is smoke, there is fire. I am sure there are lots of things undocumented.

You want to excuse him because he was a minor when some of the things occurred, or because criminal charges never came. Well, that is your choice. But if the accusation was made, and the school expelled him, with no lawsuits afterward, I am pretty sure you can assume it happened. And 12 is 12, I don't care how old he was.

I know what these people are like. Leopards don't change their spots. I don't see him ever becoming worthwhile for a team, particularly one like the Pirates. Once again, my OPINION, based on a lifetime of dealing with thugs, criminals, and pieces of crap.

And if if you overlook all of that, his ON FIELD problems and lack of hustle and desire have been well documented too. I am going to miss Morgan, but I hope Millege never sees Pittsburgh.

These guys never stay anywhere long..are able to put up some decent numbers for short periods of time, but the one thing they seem to do no matter WHERE they are, is lose. These guys tear teams apart. They always find someone to take them based on thier ability and potential, but they never help contribute to winning.

I have my opinion of him based on what I have heard and what I have read, and nothing will change my mind, unless he comes here and is a model citizen, plays hard constantly, is a good teammate and person, and does all the right things. Only time will tell.

Again though, I will not cheer for him. I think he has no business on this team. I hope to God they do not promote him just to promote him.

And I am done on the topic.

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Last edited by Animal on Wed Jul 01, 2009 6:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: WOW!! Lots and Lots of Arguments...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 6:33 pm 
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Animal wrote:
Well, I have read what I read. I have heard what I have heard. I am not going to apologize for my feelings. I don't believe I have mixed up Milledge and Dukes.

I have seen dozens of websites talking about his personal and professional life.

I know what these people are like. Leopards don't change their spots. I don't see him ever becoming worthwhile for a team, particularly one like the Pirates.

Even so, his ON FIELD problems and lack of hustle and desire have been well documented too. I am going to miss Morgan, but I hope Millege never sees Pittsburgh.

And I am done on the topic.

Your feelings are your feelings. You're entitled to them. You don't need to apologize for that. I think you probably should apologize, or at least admit that you are wrong, about some of the things that you said about Milledge since they are clearly false.


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 Post subject: Re: WOW!! Lots and Lots of Arguments...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 6:45 pm 
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burghermeister wrote:
Animal wrote:
Well, I have read what I read. I have heard what I have heard. I am not going to apologize for my feelings. I don't believe I have mixed up Milledge and Dukes.

I have seen dozens of websites talking about his personal and professional life.

I know what these people are like. Leopards don't change their spots. I don't see him ever becoming worthwhile for a team, particularly one like the Pirates.

Even so, his ON FIELD problems and lack of hustle and desire have been well documented too. I am going to miss Morgan, but I hope Millege never sees Pittsburgh.

And I am done on the topic.

Your feelings are your feelings. You're entitled to them. You don't need to apologize for that. I think you probably should apologize, or at least admit that you are wrong, about some of the things that you said about Milledge since they are clearly false.



NOT ONE THING I HAVE POSTED IS FALSE. SO NO NEED TO APOLOGIZE THERE.

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 Post subject: Re: WOW!! Lots and Lots of Arguments...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 6:50 pm 
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Animal wrote:
NOT ONE THING I HAVE POSTED IS FALSE. SO NO NEED TO APOLOGIZE THERE.

Sigh. Then please provide evidence of the 6 arrests and births by multiple mothers. If these are true, I'd really like to know but I've found NO EVIDENCE even though I've looked pretty hard.


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 Post subject: Re: WOW!! Lots and Lots of Arguments...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 7:04 pm 
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burghermeister wrote:
Animal wrote:
NOT ONE THING I HAVE POSTED IS FALSE. SO NO NEED TO APOLOGIZE THERE.

Sigh. Then please provide evidence of the 6 arrests and births by multiple mothers. If these are true, I'd really like to know but I've found NO EVIDENCE even though I've looked pretty hard.


You want evidence, find it.

Believe what you want.

You have your opinion, and I will have mine.

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 Post subject: Re: WOW!! Lots and Lots of Arguments...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 7:49 pm 
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Animal wrote:
burghermeister wrote:
Animal wrote:
NOT ONE THING I HAVE POSTED IS FALSE. SO NO NEED TO APOLOGIZE THERE.

Sigh. Then please provide evidence of the 6 arrests and births by multiple mothers. If these are true, I'd really like to know but I've found NO EVIDENCE even though I've looked pretty hard.


You want evidence, find it.

No, Animal. YOU are the one positing that Milledge has done these awful things. Therefore, the burden is on YOU to offer evidence of Milledge doing these awful things. If you can't provide any evidence of these awful things, then the likelihood is that these things never happened. We have no reason to believe that you are telling the truth without some evidence that these things actually happened.

Quote:
Believe what you want.

You have your opinion, and I will have mine.

Well, your opinion lacks merit because it lacks a factual basis. There are no facts to support your opinion. And until you provide such facts to support your opinion, everyone here has every right to think that you are either lying or deluded.

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 Post subject: Re: WOW!! Lots and Lots of Arguments...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 8:07 pm 
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Animal wrote:
You want evidence, find it.

Believe what you want.

You have your opinion, and I will have mine.

I can honestly say that this is the most disappointing and frustrating experience that I've had on this board, more frustrating by far than dealing with the likes of Ryann or Bullish. I've alway found you to be reasonable in the past, Animal. I'm really not sure where you're coming from. It's like you're playing some macho game of chicken, refusing to admit that you are mistaken even though it's obvious to everyone that you are. There simply is no evidence that Milledge was arrested six times because he wasn't. There is no evidence that he's sired multiple children with different mothers because he hasn't. It really is that simple. Your refusal to produce evidence is nothing but a facade because you don't have any because there isn't any. This is not a matter of opinion; don't try and paint it as such. It's about facts. True or false.

Milledge may be an abysmal failure here in Pittsburgh. He may be a miserable punk as you suggest. He may be completely over-hyped and turn out to be a mediocre player. He may be a clubhouse cancer and make all of us rue the day that NH traded for him. But none of that will excuse your reckless disregard for the truth in this episode.

BTW, if you do produce evidence that these allegations are true, I will be man enough to apologize and admit that I'm wrong.


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 Post subject: Re: I got a situation Question
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 8:11 pm 
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Quote:
You want evidence, find it.

Believe what you want.

You have your opinion, and I will have mine.



So basically you're saying "I'll be wrong and make damning accusations if I want."
That's fine, but you loose a lot of credibility.
I'm sure a lot of people like you will forget every false thing you've said if he comes here and hits.


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 Post subject: Re: WOW!! Lots and Lots of Arguments...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 8:42 pm 
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Animal wrote:
Well, I have read what I read. I have heard what I have heard. I am not going to apologize for my feelings. I don't believe I have mixed up Milledge and Dukes.

You're at the point now where it's time to either provide links or shut the hell up.

Quote:
I have seen dozens of websites talking about his personal and professional life. Problems with society, teammates, authority. I know these type of people well. Is it all true? Maybe, maybe not. But certainly, where there is smoke, there is fire. I am sure there are lots of things undocumented.

Dozens of websites, eh? Then you should have no trouble providing links. And save the links to fan boards. I'm not interested in hearing a bunch of folks like you who are talking out of their asses. Give us links to actual news stories.

Quote:
You want to excuse him because he was a minor when some of the things occurred, or because criminal charges never came. Well, that is your choice. But if the accusation was made, and the school expelled him, with no lawsuits afterward, I am pretty sure you can assume it happened. And 12 is 12, I don't care how old he was.

Any of our lawyers care to chime in here? You sound just like Nancy Grace.

Quote:
I know what these people are like. Leopards don't change their spots. I don't see him ever becoming worthwhile for a team, particularly one like the Pirates. Once again, my OPINION, based on a lifetime of dealing with thugs, criminals, and pieces of crap.

THESE people. Methinks i'm beginning to catch your drift now. Could it be that Lastings Milledge is a bit too black for your taste?

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 Post subject: Re: WOW!! Lots and Lots of Arguments...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 8:44 pm 
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Animal wrote:
burghermeister wrote:
Animal wrote:
Well, I have read what I read. I have heard what I have heard. I am not going to apologize for my feelings. I don't believe I have mixed up Milledge and Dukes.

I have seen dozens of websites talking about his personal and professional life.

I know what these people are like. Leopards don't change their spots. I don't see him ever becoming worthwhile for a team, particularly one like the Pirates.

Even so, his ON FIELD problems and lack of hustle and desire have been well documented too. I am going to miss Morgan, but I hope Millege never sees Pittsburgh.

And I am done on the topic.

Your feelings are your feelings. You're entitled to them. You don't need to apologize for that. I think you probably should apologize, or at least admit that you are wrong, about some of the things that you said about Milledge since they are clearly false.



NOT ONE THING I HAVE POSTED IS FALSE. SO NO NEED TO APOLOGIZE THERE.

Really? Where are all of those arrests you were talking about? Or did you forget that accusation?

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 Post subject: I Stand Corrected Burghmeister...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 9:51 pm 
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burghermeister wrote:
Animal wrote:
You want evidence, find it.

Believe what you want.

You have your opinion, and I will have mine.

I can honestly say that this is the most disappointing and frustrating experience that I've had on this board, more frustrating by far than dealing with the likes of Ryann or Bullish. I've alway found you to be reasonable in the past, Animal. I'm really not sure where you're coming from. It's like you're playing some macho game of chicken, refusing to admit that you are mistaken even though it's obvious to everyone that you are. There simply is no evidence that Milledge was arrested six times because he wasn't. There is no evidence that he's sired multiple children with different mothers because he hasn't. It really is that simple. Your refusal to produce evidence is nothing but a facade because you don't have any because there isn't any. This is not a matter of opinion; don't try and paint it as such. It's about facts. True or false.

Milledge may be an abysmal failure here in Pittsburgh. He may be a miserable punk as you suggest. He may be completely over-hyped and turn out to be a mediocre player. He may be a clubhouse cancer and make all of us rue the day that NH traded for him. But none of that will excuse your reckless disregard for the truth in this episode.

BTW, if you do produce evidence that these allegations are true, I will be man enough to apologize and admit that I'm wrong.



I know I read it somewhere. With all the arguments here, I decided to go check again. I have been searching now, and I must have indeed mixed Milledge up with Dukes regarding the kids and multiple arrests... My apoloies for that, if that is indeed what happened.

http://s2nblog.wordpress.com/2007/06/13 ... -mr-dukes/

But nonetheless, as I have said before, it's much bigger than criminal arrests. The guy has no character, no heart. Many problems with teammates, magagement, and authority in general. Maybe he can grow up and turn it around, but I seriosuly doubt it. I still believe that with the young talent we already have in the OF, and with Nyjer's play along with the intangibles, that this trade was a huge mistake. Even with their ages and "potential", I don't believe Milledge brings more to the table than Nyjer. He had already worn out his welcome in two cities. I fully expect it to happen here too. It's just the type of person he is.

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 Post subject: Re: I got a situation Question
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2009 9:53 pm 
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Well i did find something but it is from a Nationals message board and i can't tell if they are talking about Dukes or Milledge. I hope somebody can clear this up with this statement.

Quote:
OKAY, PLEASE.... lets get real here. There is no chance for a .500 team to get third place in the NL East one of the best divisions in baseball. With the Mets Phils and Braves all sitting atop it, all having a shot at first. I got even the marlins with my boy hanley finishing ahead of the nationals. They had the worst offseason of anyone EVER. Lets see who they got... Lastings Milledge, seems promising but horrible attitude so obviously hes gonna clash with Elijah Dukes (how many kids does that guy have???? oh yeah 5 KIDS 4 DIFFERENT MOTHERS PLUS HES BEEN ARRESTED 6 TIMES SINCE '98) so the both of them are gonna go good with steriod abuser, locker room killer Paul Lo Duca... No wonder why the mets got rid of him and lastings... Not to mention cocky for someone who has no skill odalis perez... i cant even imagine what the locker room is gonna be like there (possibly a fight club) and they have no where near enough talent to even compete in the nl east.. ok wow im done


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