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 Post subject: Re: The Pirates are a Joke
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 3:13 pm 
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estrago wrote:
ZelieMike wrote:
No it is not. Your model is wrong. Seats full or empty really only affects how much payroll you can afford - in the simplest sense. You fill the seats, you get the UFA to get you to the Series. You don't fill the seats, you better get that minor league thing working.

If a team like the Pirates makes $2M a year, or loses $4M, so what. It is meaningless in the day to day operations.

You want to know where they make money? Where virtually EVERY pro franchise in any sport makes money and profit?

Its when you sell.

ZM

Model? The goal of any business is to make money, year in, year out. Sure most pro sports teams mkae money when they sell. Pro sports teams dont sell all that often so the yearly profit/loss is important too. Ask any CFO if making 2M or a loss of 4M is meaningless.

Point about payroll is that if it is higher which means you in theory have better talent, should perform better,, win and have higher attendance, higher revenue. But if the talent does not perform and you dont win, no profit and you have investors to answer to. The Pirate ownership does not want to take that chance. With revenue shared, luxary tax and local TV/radio money, the Pirates can have low attendance and still be profitable.


I say keep the $50 and ban him anyway...

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I say keep the $50 and ban him anyway...

For those jumping ship, we'll keep the bandwagon warm for you...


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 Post subject: Re: The Pirates are a Joke
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 3:20 pm 
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No. It doesn't work that way, at least not in the sense where you are looking to punish the Pirates Ownershiip.

When you franchise is worth $300M more or less, and you bought it for what, $125M(??) making a mil this year, or losing 3m the next is nothing and cyclical. While you can't get too far into debt (which the McClatchey group did) the year to year operations are rather meaningless. And, you make your money on the sell down the road, and to do that, you need a full house and a winner.

It also means building a foundation.

So, no, other than keeping the debt to equity ratio in place, thus preserving the profit at sale, the yearly operations don't mean a whole lot in the scheme of profit and loss.

ZM

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 Post subject: Re: The Pirates are a Joke
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 3:25 pm 
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ZelieMike wrote:
No. It doesn't work that way, at least not in the sense where you are looking to punish the Pirates Ownershiip.

When you franchise is worth $300M more or less, and you bought it for what, $125M(??) making a mil this year, or losing 3m the next is nothing and cyclical. While you can't get too far into debt (which the McClatchey group did) the year to year operations are rather meaningless. And, you make your money on the sell down the road, and to do that, you need a full house and a winner.

It also means building a foundation.

So, no, other than keeping the debt to equity ratio in place, thus preserving the profit at sale, the yearly operations don't mean a whole lot in the scheme of profit and loss.

ZM




NO NO NO NO NO NO!!!!!

All lies...its about bobbleheads, and fireworks and bands and t shirt nights, $1 hotdogs, and Seven Springs...cheap bastards!!!

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I say keep the $50 and ban him anyway...

For those jumping ship, we'll keep the bandwagon warm for you...


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 Post subject: Re: The Pirates are a Joke
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 3:35 pm 
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You guys are bull shiting. You know nothing of how Nutting runs his team he doesn't care about winning he just cares about making more money. Get you head out of your ass and look the Pirates have lost 17 straight seasons they could easily make it to 20.

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0 straight losing seasons


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 Post subject: Re: The Pirates are a Joke
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 3:39 pm 
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And you my young friend have all the insider info on how Nutting runs his business?


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 Post subject: Re: The Pirates are a Joke
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 3:50 pm 
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Az Bucco fan wrote:
And you my young friend have all the insider info on how Nutting runs his business?


Yeah just open your eyes look at the talent on the field and the 17 straight losing seasons.
He makes money off of people coming to get their free bobbleheads/fireworks and seeing the mediocre cheap baseball team.

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 Post subject: Re: The Pirates are a Joke
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:22 pm 
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So you do have inside info? Are you an intern for the team?


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 Post subject: Re: The Pirates are a Joke
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:24 pm 
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I understand the frustration. I'm tired of losing too. Spending big money on free agents is part of the reason we're in the position we're in now. As for the Bay deal...this felt remarkably similar to the last time a beloved Buc was headed towards free agency and we pulled out all the stops to keep him. Jason Kendall...loved Jason. I still think he is baseball personified. We re-signed him for what it took to keep him, and that deal is hurting the Pirates to this day. Pulling the trigger on trades like these in question is as safe a bet as spending the big bucks on free agency. Those moves are NEVER guaranteed winners. Derek Bell?!?!?! Wil Cordero anyone?


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 Post subject: Re: The Pirates are a Joke
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:25 pm 
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Az Bucco fan wrote:
So you do have inside info? Are you an intern for the team?

Yes. I am a Pirate fan and watch the games and see what is happening with the team. I have more info then you :lol:


And parrotluv you can't just trade your established players because you signed jason kendall to a lot of money years before.

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 Post subject: Re: The Pirates are a Joke
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:28 pm 
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Do you know what inside info is ryann? I guess then I do to because I watch 120 games a year and see how the team is doing. You must realize that it is ok to agree to disagree.


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 Post subject: Re: The Pirates are a Joke
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:31 pm 
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ZelieMike wrote:
No. It doesn't work that way, at least not in the sense where you are looking to punish the Pirates Ownershiip.

When you franchise is worth $300M more or less, and you bought it for what, $125M(??) making a mil this year, or losing 3m the next is nothing and cyclical. While you can't get too far into debt (which the McClatchey group did) the year to year operations are rather meaningless. And, you make your money on the sell down the road, and to do that, you need a full house and a winner.

It also means building a foundation.

So, no, other than keeping the debt to equity ratio in place, thus preserving the profit at sale, the yearly operations don't mean a whole lot in the scheme of profit and loss.

ZM

As far as punishing Pirate ownership goes, the less amount of fans, the less amount of revenue. If they reduce their debt(payroll)so be it. There is not much esle a fan can do. You cant vote out ownership, but you can avoid their team.

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 Post subject: Re: The Pirates are a Joke
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:32 pm 
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Az Bucco fan wrote:
Do you know what inside info is ryann? I guess then I do to because I watch 120 games a year and see how the team is doing. You must realize that it is ok to agree to disagree.


I know more about the Pirates today then you! :lol:

Exactly estrago the best way the Pirate fans can punish ownership is to stop going to all those games.

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 Post subject: Re: The Pirates are a Joke
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:39 pm 
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And do what do you base that on? Have you ever played the game? Have you ever coached the game? Have you ever scouted? Tell me how you know more?


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 Post subject: Re: The Pirates are a Joke
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:40 pm 
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I wish the Bay deal didn't happen too. Sometimes I wish the Pirates had Yankee/Cub/Dodger deep pockets and would/could? purchase a contender. What fun would that really be?...only a little more fun that 17 straight losing seasons I'd think. When they build this up like they appear to be doing now...it will mean so much more than buying the success. I know to you Ryann this sounds like rah rah BS...Hope you hang in there with the rest of us :) Like a previous poster stated...are you going to jump onboard with another team? after 39 years...I can't.


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 Post subject: Re: The Pirates are a Joke
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:43 pm 
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Az Bucco fan wrote:
And do what do you base that on? Have you ever played the game? Have you ever coached the game? Have you ever scouted? Tell me how you know more?


I do play and know the ins and outs of coaching.

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 Post subject: Re: The Pirates are a Joke
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:47 pm 
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Who do you play for and where did you coach? Come on ryann answer the questions.


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 Post subject: Re: The Pirates are a Joke
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:47 pm 
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Az Bucco fan wrote:
Who do you play for and where did you coach? Come on ryann answer the questions.


I play in high school.

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 Post subject: Re: The Pirates are a Joke
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:49 pm 
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What level did you play at in HS and what position(s) do you play? Starter, bench, grade?


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 Post subject: Re: The Pirates are a Joke
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:50 pm 
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Az Bucco fan wrote:
What level did you play at in HS and what position(s) do you play? Starter, bench, grade?


Im outfielder and going to be a possible starter in 10th

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 Post subject: Re: The Pirates are a Joke
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:51 pm 
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Are you playing summer ball?


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