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 Post subject: Winning wasn't the priority tonight, showcasing was
PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2009 11:11 pm 
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I cannot believe small market johnnie made the decision on his own to leave Gorzellany in to pitch to Zimmerman.

I have come to the conclusion, that this was an order from above, that if the situation aroze, and Gorzellany was to pitch, leave him in there as long as humanly possible.
Most likely a trade would /will be coming in the next couple of day's, and Gorzo was being SHOW cased to be part of it.

The way this guy always plays too much close to the book, how does one justify leaving a lefty releiver in, against PROBABLY the hottest hitter in baseball in the last month?. At his disposal, he had Chavez, Meek, and worse come to worse, Grabow to pitch to this guy.
Did any one watching have a bit of faith, that this non move would somehow work in the Pirates favor? I certainly did not.

Only other option is Russell is just brain dead, which isn't a stretch.
Pinch hitting Andy La Roche for Vasquez in the 9th was another move i did not care for, and cetainly did not excpect. Vasquez should only hit for the pitcher, and if someone gets taken out of the game due to an injury.
Guess winning 3 or 4 is nothing to complain about, although competent managing could have set us up better for the 4 game sweep.
Really like to know if Small market Johnnie ever gets advice from the suits above the field. I am sure that would never come out in the press though.
The over use of Gorzellany in this game only can be because a deal is brewing, and his effort tonight, may have thrown a monkey wrench into it.


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 Post subject: Re: Winning wasn't the priority tonight, showcasing was
PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2009 11:34 pm 
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Small Market Jonnie?

Here's why your theory makes no sense. For Gorzzy to have ANY trade value, he would need to have some successful starts. He would need to be used in a relief role with some success. Leaving him in long is not the way to go.

Any other theories Small Minded Palushock?

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 Post subject: Re: Winning wasn't the priority tonight, showcasing was
PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 12:17 am 
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Animal wrote:
Small Market Jonnie?

Here's why your theory makes no sense. For Gorzzy to have ANY trade value, he would need to have some successful starts. He would need to be used in a relief role with some success. Leaving him in long is not the way to go.

Any other theories Small Minded Palushock?


Well i have 1 theory you may or may not be intertested in hearing.
Save some of the money you spend on crack, and purchase a hooked on phonics dvd (or vcr), case you don't have cable yet in Slicksville. Is that a real town?, or were you just trying to spell something else.
Your spelling needs lots and lots of work, but you seem like an idiot, so i guess i can let it slide.
I just think it is so rude, for someone to be critical, using grammar that is below the level of a retarted 2 year old.
I can take the feedback, but when it comes from someone who can't spell the word Johnnie. What the heck is Gorzzy?, not confident with long words?.
Leaving him in LONG is not the way to go?
What would you call his appearance tonight? a short one, or a shrort one. Just trying to make it easier for you to comprehend, fish nuts.!!

When have you ever seen a manager employ that strategy , using a lefty, facing a righty in a 1 run game, with Right Handed releivers ready in the bullpen?.
You really think this was all small market johnnie's(see how easy that was), idea?. If so, you are a total moron. All of a sudden a starter throughout his career, is being groomed to be a multi inning short man out of the pen?. Really?.
That's another thing, you are critical of my rants, you call me small minded, but you offer no solution or even a fact or theory that holds water. Do us all a favor, just go away.


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 Post subject: Re: Winning wasn't the priority tonight, showcasing was
PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 4:19 am 
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I have it on strong authority that when John Russell went by that name as a young man that he actually spelled it Johnny. In fact, most men who go by Johnny actually spell it with the Y. Johnny Carson, Cash, Depp, Knoxville, and one of my favorite 2B- Johnny Ray.

Quote:
All of a sudden a starter throughout his career, is being groomed to be a multi inning short man out of the pen?. Really?.


Didn't need a comma there, dude. When did it become proper grammar to end sentences with a question mark and a period?. What's the real estate market like for glass houses these days?


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 Post subject: Re: Winning wasn't the priority tonight, showcasing was
PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 7:37 am 
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palushock wrote:
I cannot believe small market johnnie made the decision on his own to leave Gorzellany in to pitch to Zimmerman.

I have come to the conclusion, that this was an order from above, that if the situation aroze, and Gorzellany was to pitch, leave him in there as long as humanly possible.
Most likely a trade would /will be coming in the next couple of day's, and Gorzo was being SHOW cased to be part of it.

The way this guy always plays too much close to the book, how does one justify leaving a lefty releiver in, against PROBABLY the hottest hitter in baseball in the last month?. At his disposal, he had Chavez, Meek, and worse come to worse, Grabow to pitch to this guy.
Did any one watching have a bit of faith, that this non move would somehow work in the Pirates favor? I certainly did not.

Only other option is Russell is just brain dead, which isn't a stretch.
Pinch hitting Andy La Roche for Vasquez in the 9th was another move i did not care for, and cetainly did not excpect. Vasquez should only hit for the pitcher, and if someone gets taken out of the game due to an injury.
Guess winning 3 or 4 is nothing to complain about, although competent managing could have set us up better for the 4 game sweep.
Really like to know if Small market Johnnie ever gets advice from the suits above the field. I am sure that would never come out in the press though.
The over use of Gorzellany in this game only can be because a deal is brewing, and his effort tonight, may have thrown a monkey wrench into it.


If you REALLY want to go there, I suppose we will. But when you want to poke fun at someone's spelling and grammer, perhaps you should be more careful to be correct YOURSELF.

Now, let's see what you wrote:

“Gorzellany??” -- Try Gorzelanny.

“day's?” -- The use of an apostrophe indicates some kind of possession. In this manner, you would have to say something like the day's weather, or the day's game. Understand?

“SHOW cased”? Is someone casing some kind of show??

“Pinch hitting La Roche for Vasquez in the 9th”…. First off, it’s LaRoche, not La Roche, and it’s VAZQUEZ, not Vasquez. Secondly, (or would it now be thirdly?) how could he have pinch hit LaRoche for Vazquez when LaRoche was already in the game. I suppose you MEAN pinch hitting Vazquez for LaRoche, or pinch hitting FOR LaRoche, WITH Vazquez, not the other way around.

“Winning 3 or 4”. I am guessing you mean winning 3 OF 4.

Now, onto your second post.

“i”?? This should be capitalized.

“Slicksville” Not sure if THAT’s a real town, but SLICKVILLE, from where I come certainly is.

“a retarted 2 year old” REALLY? That’s the best you have. You want to call someone retarded, and cannot even get the spelling right?? SERIOUSLY?

“Releivers” Come on, now, say it with me…. “I before E except after C.”


Okay, I am a little tired of this now. There are WAY too many errors in your post to continue. It is quite funny that you chose to complain about my use of Jonnie, when you have all the errors you have.

Oh, and one more thing… have a nice day!

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Last edited by Animal on Fri May 22, 2009 9:16 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Winning wasn't the priority tonight, showcasing was
PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 8:33 am 
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palushock wrote:
Animal wrote:
Small Market Jonnie?

Here's why your theory makes no sense. For Gorzzy to have ANY trade value, he would need to have some successful starts. He would need to be used in a relief role with some success. Leaving him in long is not the way to go.

Any other theories Small Minded Palushock?


Well i have 1 theory you may or may not be intertested in hearing.
Save some of the money you spend on crack, and purchase a hooked on phonics dvd (or vcr), case you don't have cable yet in Slicksville. Is that a real town?, or were you just trying to spell something else.
Your spelling needs lots and lots of work, but you seem like an idiot, so i guess i can let it slide.
I just think it is so rude, for someone to be critical, using grammar that is below the level of a retarted 2 year old.
I can take the feedback, but when it comes from someone who can't spell the word Johnnie. What the heck is Gorzzy?, not confident with long words?.
Leaving him in LONG is not the way to go?
What would you call his appearance tonight? a short one, or a shrort one. Just trying to make it easier for you to comprehend, fish nuts.!!

When have you ever seen a manager employ that strategy , using a lefty, facing a righty in a 1 run game, with Right Handed releivers ready in the bullpen?.
You really think this was all small market johnnie's(see how easy that was), idea?. If so, you are a total moron. All of a sudden a starter throughout his career, is being groomed to be a multi inning short man out of the pen?. Really?.
That's another thing, you are critical of my rants, you call me small minded, but you offer no solution or even a fact or theory that holds water. Do us all a favor, just go away.

The irony of this post is palpable.

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 Post subject: Re: Winning wasn't the priority tonight, showcasing was
PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 9:05 am 
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Animal wrote:
palushock wrote:
I cannot believe small market johnnie made the decision on his own to leave Gorzellany in to pitch to Zimmerman.

I have come to the conclusion, that this was an order from above, that if the situation aroze, and Gorzellany was to pitch, leave him in there as long as humanly possible.
Most likely a trade would /will be coming in the next couple of day's, and Gorzo was being SHOW cased to be part of it.

The way this guy always plays too much close to the book, how does one justify leaving a lefty releiver in, against PROBABLY the hottest hitter in baseball in the last month?. At his disposal, he had Chavez, Meek, and worse come to worse, Grabow to pitch to this guy.
Did any one watching have a bit of faith, that this non move would somehow work in the Pirates favor? I certainly did not.

Only other option is Russell is just brain dead, which isn't a stretch.
Pinch hitting Andy La Roche for Vasquez in the 9th was another move i did not care for, and cetainly did not excpect. Vasquez should only hit for the pitcher, and if someone gets taken out of the game due to an injury.
Guess winning 3 or 4 is nothing to complain about, although competent managing could have set us up better for the 4 game sweep.
Really like to know if Small market Johnnie ever gets advice from the suits above the field. I am sure that would never come out in the press though.
The over use of Gorzellany in this game only can be because a deal is brewing, and his effort tonight, may have thrown a monkey wrench into it.


If you REALLY want to go there, I suppose we will. But when you want to poke fun at someone's spelling and grammer, perhaps you should be more careful to be correct YOURSELF.

Now, let's see what you wrote:

“Gorzellany??” -- Try Gorzelanny.

“day's?” -- The use of an apostrophe indicates some kind of possession. In this manner, you would have to say something like the day's weather, or the day's game. Understand?

“SHOW cased”? Is someone casing some kind of show??

“Pinch hitting La Roche for Vasquez in the 9th”…. First off, it’s LaRoche, not La Roche, and it’s VAZQUEZ, not Vasquez. Secondly, (or would it now be thirdly?) how could he have pinch hit LaRoche for Vazquez when LaRoche was already in the game. I suppose you MEAN pinch hitting Vazquez for LaRoche, or pinch hitting FOR LaRoche, WITH Vazquez, not the other way around.

“Winning 3 or 4”. I am guessing you mean winning 3 OF 4.

Now, onto your second post.

“i”?? This should be capitalized.

“Slicksville” Not sure if THAT’s a real town, but SLICKVILLE, from where I come certainly is.

“a retarted 2 year old” REALLY? That’s the best you have. You want to call someone retarded, and cannot even get the spelling right?? SERIOUSLY?

“Relievers” Come on, now, say it with me…. “I before E except after C.”


Okay, I am a little tired of this now. There are WAY too many errors in your post to continue. It is quite funny that you chose to complain about my use of Jonnie, when you have all the errors you have.

Oh, and one more thing… have a nice day!


Animal just showed everyone how to win an argument. I was spelling Vazquez wrong also. You made me realize that, but isn't it spelled relievers . He has the I before the E. Unless you already corrected it in your post.


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 Post subject: Re: Winning wasn't the priority tonight, showcasing was
PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 9:06 am 
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The lesson that should be learned is called proof reading. Unless it is during the game. I have seen some of the best come up with things that aren't readable then.


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 Post subject: Re: Winning wasn't the priority tonight, showcasing was
PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 9:19 am 
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Thanks Colin.

I had relievers correct, but changed it to reflect the incorrect way Small Minded posted.

Personally, I don't like to correct one's grammer, spelling, and punctuation on a message board, but I felt Small Minded had it coming. I hate the use of the word "retarded", particuarly the way he used it.

My apologies to the board for my personal slam on him. But it was really so funny that he would attack me for my spelling of "jonnie" when he has so much wrong with his post!

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 Post subject: Re: Winning wasn't the priority tonight, showcasing was
PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 9:22 am 
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Please tell me I'm not seeing this thread...can't be....no......must just be my imagination!!!


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 Post subject: Re: Winning wasn't the priority tonight, showcasing was
PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 9:35 am 
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To be honest with you...if they REALLY want to showcase him for a trade, he would be starting, probably at AAA, to show everybody that "he is back."

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 Post subject: Re: Winning wasn't the priority tonight, showcasing was
PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 12:01 pm 
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palushock wrote:
The way this guy always plays too much close to the book, how does one justify leaving a lefty releiver in, against PROBABLY the hottest hitter in baseball in the last month?. At his disposal, he had Chavez, Meek, and worse come to worse, Grabow to pitch to this guy.


If you are looking for a "reason," his name is Adam Dunn and he hits from the left side. I am quite certain that Russell's "justification" was that didn't want to pull Gorzo against Zimmerman to bring in Chavez and then immediately turn around and pull Chavez to bring in Grabow to face Dunn. Good strategy? Ehhhh . . . Lousy strategy? Ehhh . . .

Would I have done the same? Probably not but I also don't have Kerrigan in my ear telling me who is healthy, who is not healthy, who matches up well with whom, etc., etc. Remember . . . there is also a pitching coach in the dugout and he is consulted all the time with respect to pitching decisions. If you don't like what Russell is doing with the pitching staff, don't you also have to be critical of, or at least question Kerrigan as well????

And, for what it is worth, I've seen plenty of managers leave a pitcher in the game - eschewing the righty/righty, lefty/lefty matchups - when the on-deck hitter gives a good match-up. Sometimes it works; sometimes it doesn't.

Finally, weren't you the one being critical of Russell just the other night for playing too much by the book (I believe you said "EFFIN book"). So . . . when he plays by the book, you don't like that and when he doesn't play by the book, you don't like that either.

For the record, I did not like the choice of pinch hitting for LaRoche at the time. Not only is he hitting the ball well but he has demonstrated a much better eye at the plate as of lately. Vazquez has been hot off the bench but I wouldn't have gone with him. If you were looking for the righty/lefty combo, I would have chosen Hinske with the hope that he turned around one of those 95-96 mph heaters and planted one in the seats.

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 Post subject: Re: Winning wasn't the priority tonight, showcasing was
PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 1:38 pm 
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palushock wrote:
Animal wrote:
Small Market Jonnie?

Here's why your theory makes no sense. For Gorzzy to have ANY trade value, he would need to have some successful starts. He would need to be used in a relief role with some success. Leaving him in long is not the way to go.

Any other theories Small Minded Palushock?


Well i have 1 theory you may or may not be intertested in hearing.
Save some of the money you spend on crack, and purchase a hooked on phonics dvd (or vcr), case you don't have cable yet in Slicksville. Is that a real town?, or were you just trying to spell something else.
Your spelling needs lots and lots of work, but you seem like an idiot, so i guess i can let it slide.
I just think it is so rude, for someone to be critical, using grammar that is below the level of a retarted 2 year old.
I can take the feedback, but when it comes from someone who can't spell the word Johnnie. What the heck is Gorzzy?, not confident with long words?.
Leaving him in LONG is not the way to go?
What would you call his appearance tonight? a short one, or a shrort one. Just trying to make it easier for you to comprehend, fish nuts.!!

When have you ever seen a manager employ that strategy , using a lefty, facing a righty in a 1 run game, with Right Handed releivers ready in the bullpen?.
You really think this was all small market johnnie's(see how easy that was), idea?. If so, you are a total moron. All of a sudden a starter throughout his career, is being groomed to be a multi inning short man out of the pen?. Really?.
That's another thing, you are critical of my rants, you call me small minded, but you offer no solution or even a fact or theory that holds water. Do us all a favor, just go away.



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Keep on posting the truth, they cannot take it.


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 Post subject: Re: Winning wasn't the priority tonight, showcasing was
PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 1:41 pm 
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No. 9 wrote:
palushock wrote:
The way this guy always plays too much close to the book, how does one justify leaving a lefty releiver in, against PROBABLY the hottest hitter in baseball in the last month?. At his disposal, he had Chavez, Meek, and worse come to worse, Grabow to pitch to this guy.


If you are looking for a "reason," his name is Adam Dunn and he hits from the left side. I am quite certain that Russell's "justification" was that didn't want to pull Gorzo against Zimmerman to bring in Chavez and then immediately turn around and pull Chavez to bring in Grabow to face Dunn. Good strategy? Ehhhh . . . Lousy strategy? Ehhh . . .


It was lousy. Gorzo looked nothing like he did an inning earlier. All his outs were fly balls and the heart of the order was up. There were better options. JR failed.


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 Post subject: Re: Winning wasn't the priority tonight, showcasing was
PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 1:49 pm 
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Argentum wrote:
No. 9 wrote:
palushock wrote:
The way this guy always plays too much close to the book, how does one justify leaving a lefty releiver in, against PROBABLY the hottest hitter in baseball in the last month?. At his disposal, he had Chavez, Meek, and worse come to worse, Grabow to pitch to this guy.


If you are looking for a "reason," his name is Adam Dunn and he hits from the left side. I am quite certain that Russell's "justification" was that didn't want to pull Gorzo against Zimmerman to bring in Chavez and then immediately turn around and pull Chavez to bring in Grabow to face Dunn. Good strategy? Ehhhh . . . Lousy strategy? Ehhh . . .


It was lousy. Gorzo looked nothing like he did an inning earlier. All his outs were fly balls and the heart of the order was up. There were better options. JR failed.


Argentum -
Admittedly I did not see the game. I was watching the little dots on my Blackberry and catching bits and pieces on the radio between errands. And I stand by my point that, if Gorzo doesn't have it, the buck stops with JR but Kerrigan is the pitching coach and knows his pitchers better than anyone (including JR). It is Kerrigan's job to go to JR and say "I'm calling the bullpen, they are getting Grabow (or Burnett) up, Gorzo's done, get him outta there, Chavez will get Zimmerman, and Grabow will get Dunn."
Any criticism of how the staff is being handled cannot get past Kerrigan as well.

_________________
Reflexively, obsessively and tastelessly submitted,
No. 9
Obsessive proponent of situational bunting and 2 strike hitting approaches, reflexively pro-catchers calling good games and tasteless proponent of the value of a RBI.


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 Post subject: Re: Winning wasn't the priority tonight, showcasing was
PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 2:10 pm 
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palushock wrote:
I cannot believe small market johnnie made the decision on his own to leave Gorzellany in to pitch to Zimmerman.

I have come to the conclusion, that this was an order from above, that if the situation aroze, and Gorzellany was to pitch, leave him in there as long as humanly possible.
Most likely a trade would /will be coming in the next couple of day's, and Gorzo was being SHOW cased to be part of it.

The way this guy always plays too much close to the book, how does one justify leaving a lefty releiver in, against PROBABLY the hottest hitter in baseball in the last month?. At his disposal, he had Chavez, Meek, and worse come to worse, Grabow to pitch to this guy.
Did any one watching have a bit of faith, that this non move would somehow work in the Pirates favor? I certainly did not.

Only other option is Russell is just brain dead, which isn't a stretch.
Pinch hitting Andy La Roche for Vasquez in the 9th was another move i did not care for, and cetainly did not excpect. Vasquez should only hit for the pitcher, and if someone gets taken out of the game due to an injury.
Guess winning 3 or 4 is nothing to complain about, although competent managing could have set us up better for the 4 game sweep.
Really like to know if Small market Johnnie ever gets advice from the suits above the field. I am sure that would never come out in the press though.
The over use of Gorzellany in this game only can be because a deal is brewing, and his effort tonight, may have thrown a monkey wrench into it.



How and why would you be showcasing Gorzo for a trade out of the bullpen when he has been a starter his entire life?

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 Post subject: Re: Winning wasn't the priority tonight, showcasing was
PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 2:20 pm 
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Despite the odd and entertaining turn this thread took, I think the Gorzelanny situation is interesting. Now, I'm not sure the Pirates were showcasing him for a trade by leaving him in, but I think there is some merit to leaving him in to see what he could do even though it may not have been the best strategic move. But I don't think it had anything to do with a potential trade. Gorzelanny (am I spelling it correctly?) has very little trade value currently and allowing him to pitch an addition inning or two isn't going to change that. I don't know if he'll ever duplicate his 2007 success, but any thought on trading him right now should be dismissed as the Pirates would be selling low. He's still a relatively young pitcher with some talent so the Pirates would be best served finding out what they have in him as that is more valuable than anything they would likely net in a deal.

So in my opinion, it appears they're giving Gorzelanny an opportunity to pitch against major league hitters. That's a good thing. If he's successful, I think they have hopes of re-inserting him back into the starting rotation. Not only is that where he's had more success and will be properly utilized, it's not as if the Pirates need another left handed reliever. And as soon as Yates and Hansen are off the DL, they'll need to move a couple of guys.

(for the record, I have not proof read any of this and would appreciate ya'll overlooking any spelling or grammatical errors as I think my points still stand)


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 Post subject: Re: Winning wasn't the priority tonight, showcasing was
PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 2:43 pm 
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Alexandria Dukes wrote:
Despite the odd and entertaining turn this thread took, I think the Gorzelanny situation is interesting. Now, I'm not sure the Pirates were showcasing him for a trade by leaving him in, but I think there is some merit to leaving him in to see what he could do even though it may not have been the best strategic move. But I don't think it had anything to do with a potential trade. Gorzelanny (am I spelling it correctly?) has very little trade value currently and allowing him to pitch an addition inning or two isn't going to change that. I don't know if he'll ever duplicate his 2007 success, but any thought on trading him right now should be dismissed as the Pirates would be selling low. He's still a relatively young pitcher with some talent so the Pirates would be best served finding out what they have in him as that is more valuable than anything they would likely net in a deal.

So in my opinion, it appears they're giving Gorzelanny an opportunity to pitch against major league hitters. That's a good thing. If he's successful, I think they have hopes of re-inserting him back into the starting rotation. Not only is that where he's had more success and will be properly utilized, it's not as if the Pirates need another left handed reliever. And as soon as Yates and Hansen are off the DL, they'll need to move a couple of guys.

(for the record, I have not proof read any of this and would appreciate ya'll overlooking any spelling or grammatical errors as I think my points still stand)


I think Alexandria Dukes makes some excellent points here. It's such a shame that he so overused the passive voice in making them.


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 Post subject: Re: Winning wasn't the priority tonight, showcasing was
PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 3:07 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Winning wasn't the priority tonight, showcasing was
PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2009 3:48 pm 
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Bucfan wrote:
Image


While the spelling police is out...I'm pretty certain the man leading the charge is named Mahoney!!!

Attachment:
080626132715.jpg
080626132715.jpg [ 39.16 KiB | Viewed 285 times ]

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