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 Post subject: Re: TIME FOR KARSTENS TO GO!
PostPosted: Sun May 03, 2009 11:37 pm 
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Rod Serling wrote:
Although Karstens is not getting it done, I'll go ahead and argue that the problem is with the offense, not the pitching, which is currently still first in the National League. I'm not sure, but it seems like the THREE SHUTOUTS IN FOUR GAMES might have something to do with it.

No, that is the result of our poor offense, not the cause.

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 Post subject: Re: TIME FOR KARSTENS TO GO!
PostPosted: Sun May 03, 2009 11:46 pm 
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Its a little bit of both really. Karstens needs to pitch better and we need a better offense. Who was that guy we had who won the ROY and was an all star? Wait we traded him for WHO?

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 Post subject: Re: TIME FOR KARSTENS TO GO!
PostPosted: Sun May 03, 2009 11:54 pm 
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Ryann wrote:
Its a little bit of both really. Karstens needs to pitch better and we need a better offense. Who was that guy we had who won the ROY and was an all star? Wait we traded him for WHO?


Their starting third baseman and top pitching prospect.


Last edited by Alexandria Dukes on Sun May 03, 2009 11:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: TIME FOR KARSTENS TO GO!
PostPosted: Sun May 03, 2009 11:57 pm 
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No your wrong their starting 3rd basemen was casey blake i know we didnt get him we got a FORMER top prospect who gives no power from a power position. And wait this top pitching prospect i assume he is a very healthy young man with no prior arm conditions?

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 Post subject: Re: TIME FOR KARSTENS TO GO!
PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2009 12:19 am 
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After reading all of this i'm feeling so down about our #5 spot i think we should just give it to the parrot. He's never been given a chance, or they could have pitch for the Pirates night where they pick one lucky fan from the crowd to pitch the game. It will help fan attendance and really thats all the upper managemnt of the organization cares about.


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 Post subject: Re: TIME FOR KARSTENS TO GO!
PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2009 10:01 am 
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Dumatrait has a low 90s fastball, a good curve, and an average change. If he can learn to throw all three for strikes he's way ahead of Karstens and his below average everything. Dumatrait may well end up being replacement level, but Karstens has an ERA+ of 71 right now and I see no room for improvement. That's not too hard to top.


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 Post subject: Re: TIME FOR KARSTENS TO GO!
PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2009 10:27 am 
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It could be worse, we could have one of the 31 other major league pitchers who have at least 4 starts and have an ERA higher than Karstens' 5.85. That's right, 31, slightly more than one per team; I just counted. And that doesn't count the 15 or so that have somewhere between 1 and 3 starts who also have higher ERAs.

Like it or not, Karstens is pretty much par for the course for 5th starters in this league. Most teams have at least one pitcher like him. Personally, I think he might work out alright if he can get his control back. So far this season his walks per 9 innings is 5.85; prior to this season, for his career, it was 2.50. If he could get down to that level, he'd probably be ok - not great, but acceptable for a 5th starter.

BM


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 Post subject: Re: TIME FOR KARSTENS TO GO!
PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2009 10:34 am 
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burghermeister wrote:
Personally, I think he might work out alright if he can get his control back.


I wonder though if his control issues are a product of below average talent? Specifically, he's afraid to throw strikes because he knows there's a good chance they'll end up in the Allegheny.


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 Post subject: Re: TIME FOR KARSTENS TO GO!
PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2009 11:09 am 
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burghermeister wrote:
It could be worse, we could have one of the 31 other major league pitchers who have at least 4 starts and have an ERA higher than Karstens' 5.85. That's right, 31, slightly more than one per team; I just counted. And that doesn't count the 15 or so that have somewhere between 1 and 3 starts who also have higher ERAs.

Like it or not, Karstens is pretty much par for the course for 5th starters in this league. Most teams have at least one pitcher like him. Personally, I think he might work out alright if he can get his control back. So far this season his walks per 9 innings is 5.85; prior to this season, for his career, it was 2.50. If he could get down to that level, he'd probably be ok - not great, but acceptable for a 5th starter.

BM


You're comparing apples to oranges in some cases...ERA itself doesn't adjust for the park the guy plays in, and Karstens throws in a pitcher's park. Also, you can't really compare straight up ERAs of NL to AL pitchers because of the DH.

But I agree with you. If you look at ERA+, which does adjust for the pitcher's park, there are around 15 starting pitchers with four or more games started in the NL with ERA+ either about the same or worse than Karstens (including three on the Mets). And like you pointed out, this does not account for the fact that some teams are distributing their 4/5 starts between four guys, like San Diego. For a 4/5 in the NL, Karstens is doing fine.

When a team that wasn't strong offensively to begin with has two of its best hitters shelved, the results are going to be ugly.


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 Post subject: Re: TIME FOR KARSTENS TO GO!
PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2009 11:13 am 
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Never mind, McLouth was in yesterday, I haven't been paying attention lately.


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 Post subject: Re: TIME FOR KARSTENS TO GO!
PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2009 11:22 pm 
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Colin21 wrote:
After reading all of this i'm feeling so down about our #5 spot i think we should just give it to the parrot. He's never been given a chance, or they could have pitch for the Pirates night where they pick one lucky fan from the crowd to pitch the game. It will help fan attendance and really thats all the upper managemnt of the organization cares about.



That is a true good idea right there! Just pick the crowd!

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