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 Post subject: Brodie Van Wagenen Calling For A Boycott of Spring Training
PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2018 12:33 pm 
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https://sports.yahoo.com/high-powered-b ... 27377.html

Collusion or are owners finally realizing giving aging or one year wonder players $100 million contracts is hurtful in the long run?

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 Post subject: Re: Brodie Van Wagenen Calling For A Boycott of Spring Train
PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2018 1:53 pm 
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nad69dan wrote:
https://sports.yahoo.com/high-powered-baseball-agent-threatens-spring-training-boycott-180127377.html

Collusion or are owners finally realizing giving aging or one year wonder players $100 million contracts is hurtful in the long run?


Both.

Sadly, this is partly the players fault for negotiating deals that benefit youth. What did they think would happen? "Trickle down" economics doesn't work. Look at the NFL. Rich owners aren't going to pay players guaranteed money out of the kindness of their hearts [because revenue is up].

American ignorance and naivety are near their peak right now. People have forgotten that rich people don't give an F about them, whether you're a 'blue collar' worker or a millionaire athlete.

The next CBA negotiations will be interesting.

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 Post subject: Re: Brodie Van Wagenen Calling For A Boycott of Spring Train
PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2018 5:33 pm 
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Just a market correction to realize value versus payment. Capitalism works.

ZM

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 Post subject: Re: Brodie Van Wagenen Calling For A Boycott of Spring Train
PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2018 6:24 pm 
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Free agents are out there for a vastly more reasonable price than years past.

Alex Avila for $4.25 million per? Wow.

Still available - Jose Bautista, Melky Cabrera, Tyler Clippard, Alex Cobb, Todd Frazier, Jaime Garcia, Carlos Gomez, Carlos Gonzalez, Jeremy Hellickson, Greg Holland, Jonathan Lucroy, J.D. Martinez, Mike Moustakas, Eduardo Nunez, Seung-Hwan Oh, Colby Rasmus, Trevor Rosenthal, Michael Saunders, and Neil Walker.

Lots of good players, and quite a few for a very, very reasonable price.

Huntington should have signed Avila. One guy who interests me is Lucroy, but he's not signing for $4.25 million. Dude is worth up to $14 million per based on very high-level defense and solid hitting. His ISO tanked last year, which is a concern, but he still hits for excellent BA, walks, does not fan, and his career ISO suggests he will rebound.

Sign him for $9.5 million for 2 seasons, basically what Russell Martin received. He is coming off a down season, like Martin, but his advanced stats and defense indicate he is well worth the price - like Martin.


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 Post subject: Re: Brodie Van Wagenen Calling For A Boycott of Spring Train
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 12:11 am 
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ZelieMike wrote:
Just a market correction to realize value versus payment. Capitalism works.

ZM


This. Things went wacky during the steroid era. For 100 years guys peaked in their late 20s and declined sharply after 32-33. The market is simply just getting back to normal.


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 Post subject: Re: Brodie Van Wagenen Calling For A Boycott of Spring Train
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 2:34 am 
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Bucfan wrote:
Huntington should have signed Avila. One guy who interests me is Lucroy, but he's not signing for $4.25 million. Dude is worth up to $14 million per based on very high-level defense and solid hitting. His ISO tanked last year, which is a concern, but he still hits for excellent BA, walks, does not fan, and his career ISO suggests he will rebound.


Would LuCroy TAKE that deal, though?!

THAT'S the problem!

Teams can OFFER deals, but if PLAYERS don't accept is it REALLY """collusion"""??? On one hand yes, because 29 teams saying 'no' screams 'collusion'. On the other, '30 teams figuring out that an aging vet on the downside of their career isn't worth $$$XM' isn't REALLY "collusion"', but "market correction/efficiency".

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 Post subject: Re: Brodie Van Wagenen Calling For A Boycott of Spring Train
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 12:05 pm 
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NSMaster56 wrote:
Bucfan wrote:
Huntington should have signed Avila. One guy who interests me is Lucroy, but he's not signing for $4.25 million. Dude is worth up to $14 million per based on very high-level defense and solid hitting. His ISO tanked last year, which is a concern, but he still hits for excellent BA, walks, does not fan, and his career ISO suggests he will rebound.


Would LuCroy TAKE that deal, though?!

THAT'S the problem!

Teams can OFFER deals, but if PLAYERS don't accept is it REALLY """collusion"""??? On one hand yes, because 29 teams saying 'no' screams 'collusion'. On the other, '30 teams figuring out that an aging vet on the downside of their career isn't worth $$$XM' isn't REALLY "collusion"', but "market correction/efficiency".


This is why the players may push for a cap in the next CBA. A cap creates a floor and also establishes the revenue split between the players and the owners.


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 Post subject: Re: Brodie Van Wagenen Calling For A Boycott of Spring Train
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 12:51 pm 
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NSMaster56 wrote:
Would Lucroy TAKE that deal, though?!

THAT'S the problem!

Given that teams now seem to have zero interest in paying tens of millions to 30-year old free agents, have generally learned their lesson with such deals, and given that he may be waiting for his FIRST offer, then the answer is probably "yes."

$19 million over two seasons is a hell of a lot more than 0 over 1 season.


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 Post subject: Re: Brodie Van Wagenen Calling For A Boycott of Spring Train
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 1:43 pm 
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Spring training baseball sucks...that's the best reason to boycott spring training.... 8-) 8-) 8-)


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 Post subject: Re: Brodie Van Wagenen Calling For A Boycott of Spring Train
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 2:19 pm 
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Az Bucco fan wrote:
Spring training baseball sucks...that's the best reason to boycott spring training.... 8-) 8-) 8-)


I used to attend spring training games for years. I enjoyed them.


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 Post subject: Re: Brodie Van Wagenen Calling For A Boycott of Spring Train
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 2:22 pm 
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Bucfan wrote:
NSMaster56 wrote:
Would Lucroy TAKE that deal, though?!

THAT'S the problem!

Given that teams now seem to have zero interest in paying tens of millions to 30-year old free agents, have generally learned their lesson with such deals, and given that he may be waiting for his FIRST offer, then the answer is probably "yes."

$19 million over two seasons is a hell of a lot more than 0 over 1 season.


Of course. "50% of something is better than 100% of nothing".

The owners have all the leverage. The players assume all the risk.

It's funny that baseball players, who have guaranteed contracts and don't usually suffer from life-damaging injuries, are calling this out the loudest. You'd think that NFL players would be the ones leading the charge. Alas, the likes of Kaepernick have been effectively neutralized by the "Greed is Good" overlords.

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 Post subject: Re: Brodie Van Wagenen Calling For A Boycott of Spring Train
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 2:30 pm 
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Pirates still have holes they can fill from this group that would make them a competitor (note, ZM likes the pitching). I think I'm seeing a Matt Joyce type of signing here. Not necessarily a rebound guy, but a ST signing at best price possible.

ZM

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 Post subject: Re: Brodie Van Wagenen Calling For A Boycott of Spring Train
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 6:44 pm 
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Quote:
The Pirates will likely sign a budding star named Eno On.


Eno On will likely be signed by the Pirates by the start of the season.The Pirates value Eno On more than they value money. The Pirates will have Eno On to deal at the trade deadline, And if not the Pirate fans will have Eno On to look forward to for years to come.


The Pirates new face of the franchise..... Eno On

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 Post subject: Re: Brodie Van Wagenen Calling For A Boycott of Spring Train
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 12:17 am 
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Yeah, great player, that Eno On...


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 Post subject: Re: Brodie Van Wagenen Calling For A Boycott of Spring Train
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 12:39 am 
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doug frobel wrote:
Yeah, great player, that Eno On...

Hey, I'm mildly dyslexic, and am concerned about this Eno On issue. Sounds like he could be ... well, okay, I'm just going to say it, NO ONE!!


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 Post subject: Re: Brodie Van Wagenen Calling For A Boycott of Spring Train
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 1:34 am 
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Would someone clue me in as to who the fuck is Brodie Van Wagenen????????????? :? :? :? :?

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 Post subject: Re: Brodie Van Wagenen Calling For A Boycott of Spring Train
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 2:31 am 
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bassoondirector wrote:
Would someone clue me in as to who the fuck is Brodie Van Wagenen????????????? :? :? :? :?


He is Eno On.


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 Post subject: Re: Brodie Van Wagenen Calling For A Boycott of Spring Train
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 8:44 am 
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bassoondirector wrote:
Would someone clue me in as to who the fuck is Brodie Van Wagenen????????????? :? :? :? :?


He is an agent.


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 Post subject: Re: Brodie Van Wagenen Calling For A Boycott of Spring Train
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 10:09 am 
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rellimie wrote:
I used to attend spring training games for years. I enjoyed them.


Me too, when tickets were reasonably priced. I refuse to pay 30 bucks to see #88 play second base...friend of mine has a built in rule that when the combined numbers of the infielders totals more than 200, it is time to leave... 8-) 8-) 8-)


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 Post subject: Re: Brodie Van Wagenen Calling For A Boycott of Spring Train
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 11:41 am 
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Az Bucco fan wrote:
rellimie wrote:
I used to attend spring training games for years. I enjoyed them.


Me too, when tickets were reasonably priced. I refuse to pay 30 bucks to see #88 play second base...friend of mine has a built in rule that when the combined numbers of the infielders totals more than 200, it is time to leave... 8-) 8-) 8-)


I just like going to Florida so if I was there I would be on vacation and I wouldn't care that much about the price or who was playing. Hopefully soon I will do that, but not this year.

But If I lived there I could see not wanting to pay that.

I won't watch it on TV other than a few minutes. It just doesn't mean anything.


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