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 Post subject: Cole Traded to the Astros - For Real This Time
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 8:41 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Cole Traded to the Astros - For Real This Time
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 8:42 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Cole Traded to the Astros - For Real This Time
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 8:43 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Cole Traded to the Astros - For Real This Time
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 8:46 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Cole Traded to the Astros - For Real This Time
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 8:53 pm 
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So we got an "eh" reliever, a potential starter, a basically rookie 3b with some upside and a AA OF with some pop in the bat....Musgrove is a big dude.....we shall see..... 8-) 8-) 8-)


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 Post subject: Re: Cole Traded to the Astros - For Real This Time
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:02 pm 
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Had to look up the guys we got. Seems like the big win was saving money since these guys are league minimum with lots of control. Maybe if we take the savings and invest it in some more talent that we need? Fact is we were never resigning him so I guess we take our chances and maybe one of these guys turn into something serviceable. Would like to hear what the rest of you guys think. I know nothing. :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Cole Traded to the Astros - For Real This Time
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:03 pm 
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Typical. We ask for top prospects, they decline, and we take some middling guys. For a guy that we didn’t HAVE to trade right now.

Musgrove is average at best.
Feliz is high strike out high walk guy. Another power arm for the pen.
Moran is a guy who Baseball Prospectus said “you will always be looking to replace him”. Hell, he may not be better than Freese...definitely not defensively.
Martin....eh....


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 Post subject: Re: Cole Traded to the Astros - For Real This Time
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:09 pm 
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Nothing exciting about this trade though that doesn’t mean it will end poorly. Musgrove “could” be a solid #2 or 3 guy in the future. Moran “could” be a legit third baseman. Feliz “could” be a solid performer in the pen. Martin “could” develop into a depth OFer. That’s a lot of “could be”s.


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 Post subject: Re: Cole Traded to the Astros - For Real This Time
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:17 pm 
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hebner20 wrote:
Maybe if we take the savings and invest it in some more talent that we need?


Im still waiting for them to spend the savings from Marte’s suspension and Kang’s not arrival as promised.

The fact is they always talk about redirecting salary dumps back into payroll and never actually do it.


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 Post subject: Re: Cole Traded to the Astros - For Real This Time
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:20 pm 
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Chris Anderson wrote:
Nothing exciting about this trade though that doesn’t mean it will end poorly. Musgrove “could” be a solid #2 or 3 guy in the future. Moran “could” be a legit third baseman. Feliz “could” be a solid performer in the pen. Martin “could” develop into a depth OFer. That’s a lot of “could be”s.



A lot of “coulds” for a guy you could have kept for a year and probably got a similar haul. Typical Pirates. Won’t commit to win. Won’t make the trades that setup for the future either.


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 Post subject: Re: Cole Traded to the Astros - For Real This Time
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 10:34 pm 
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Gut instinct: do not 'get', nor like, this deal. Cole is better than this return. Where's the OF who can play now so the team can flip Cutch?

Time will tell, but... ugh.

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 Post subject: Re: Cole Traded to the Astros - For Real This Time
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 10:51 pm 
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Chris Anderson wrote:
Nothing exciting about this trade though that doesn’t mean it will end poorly. Musgrove “could” be a solid #2 or 3 guy in the future. Moran “could” be a legit third baseman. Feliz “could” be a solid performer in the pen. Martin “could” develop into a depth OFer. That’s a lot of “could be”s.


All prospects are “could be’s“ until they aren’t.


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 Post subject: Re: Cole Traded to the Astros - For Real This Time
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 10:52 pm 
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NSMaster56 wrote:
Gut instinct: do not 'get', nor like, this deal. Cole is better than this return. Where's the OF who can play now so the team can flip Cutch?

Time will tell, but... ugh.


He isn’t though. We just 4 pretty good prospects/players for a #2/3 starter.


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 Post subject: Re: Cole Traded to the Astros - For Real This Time
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 11:01 pm 
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rellimie wrote:
Chris Anderson wrote:
Nothing exciting about this trade though that doesn’t mean it will end poorly. Musgrove “could” be a solid #2 or 3 guy in the future. Moran “could” be a legit third baseman. Feliz “could” be a solid performer in the pen. Martin “could” develop into a depth OFer. That’s a lot of “could be”s.


All prospects are “could be’s“ until they aren’t.


And Huntington’s record when acquiring prospects has not been good. More “aren’ts” than hits.


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 Post subject: Re: Cole Traded to the Astros - For Real This Time
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 11:12 pm 
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rellimie wrote:
NSMaster56 wrote:
Gut instinct: do not 'get', nor like, this deal. Cole is better than this return. Where's the OF who can play now so the team can flip Cutch?

Time will tell, but... ugh.


He isn’t though. We just 4 pretty good prospects/players for a #2/3 starter.

If Cole is a #2/3 starter, then one of the “pretty good” prospects we got is about a #8/9 starter.


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 Post subject: Re: Cole Traded to the Astros - For Real This Time
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 11:15 pm 
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PirateParrot wrote:
rellimie wrote:
NSMaster56 wrote:
Gut instinct: do not 'get', nor like, this deal. Cole is better than this return. Where's the OF who can play now so the team can flip Cutch?

Time will tell, but... ugh.


He isn’t though. We just 4 pretty good prospects/players for a #2/3 starter.

If Cole is a #2/3 starter, then one of the “pretty good” prospects we got is about a #8/9 starter.


What has Cole done to be an Ace/#1? Not saying he’s a bad pitcher and not the best on the Pirates but he’s not even close to a #1 when looking across the league.


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 Post subject: Re: Cole Traded to the Astros - For Real This Time
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 11:22 pm 
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Too early to tell on this one right now. Some deals look like a win or a loss right away- not this one. I wanted Moran, so that was good. But I really wanted Fisher. What this tells me is that the front office is not going to trade McCutchen, or they are doubtful that they will be able to. We'll see what Uncle Ray can do with the arms. The other outfielder doesn't project to be a stud, but he is not very far away fro the big leagues.


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 Post subject: Re: Cole Traded to the Astros - For Real This Time
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 11:25 pm 
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doug frobel wrote:
Too early to tell on this one right now. Some deals look like a win or a loss right away- not this one. I wanted Moran, so that was good. But I really wanted Fisher. What this tells me is that the front office is not going to trade McCutchen, or they are doubtful that they will be able to. We'll see what Uncle Ray can do with the arms. The other outfielder doesn't project to be a stud, but he is not very far away fro the big leagues.


I agree with this. I like Moran a lot. Musgrove is 3 years younger than Cole and could be just as good as Cole has been the past few seasons.


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 Post subject: Re: Cole Traded to the Astros - For Real This Time
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 11:49 pm 
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Per Email received from pirates:

Pirates acquire Michael Feliz, Jason Martin, Colin Moran and Joe Musgrove from Houston in exchange for Gerrit Cole
The Pittsburgh Pirates today acquired right-handed relief pitcher Michael Feliz, outfielder Jason Martin, third baseman Colin Moran and right-handed starting pitcher Joe Musgrove from the Houston Astros in exchange for Gerrit Cole. The announcement was made by Executive Vice President, General Manager Neal Huntington.

"Trading Gerrit Cole was not an easy decision. We are very appreciative for what Gerrit has done for our team and organization, especially his important role on the 2013-15 playoff teams," added Huntington. “Acquiring these four quality young players, three of whom we project to be an important part of our 2018 team, with many years of potential contribution, is an important step for us as we work toward bringing playoff baseball back to our fans."

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 Post subject: Re: Cole Traded to the Astros - For Real This Time
PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 12:10 am 
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rellimie wrote:
doug frobel wrote:
Too early to tell on this one right now. Some deals look like a win or a loss right away- not this one. I wanted Moran, so that was good. But I really wanted Fisher. What this tells me is that the front office is not going to trade McCutchen, or they are doubtful that they will be able to. We'll see what Uncle Ray can do with the arms. The other outfielder doesn't project to be a stud, but he is not very far away fro the big leagues.


I agree with this. I like Moran a lot. Musgrove is 3 years younger than Cole and could be just as good as Cole has been the past few seasons.

Well...I can take your word for it or I could assume the Astros front office, who is no TMTIB but not bad, know what they are doing. And they seemed to want Cole rather than plug Musgrove into their rotation.

Cole wasn’t an ace, but he was a solid #2 without any question. With two years of service left they should’ve been able to get one upper prospect in the trade. Any trade could turn out well but as someone above said this one will take a lot of “coulds” to turn our way.


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