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 Post subject: Padres a trading partner?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2014 1:53 pm 
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I wonder if the Padres might make a good trading partner for first base for us? They have a logjam with Alonso, Medica, and Blanks. If they ever move Gyorko to third, they would also have Headley in the first base mix.

Tommy Medica is the one who really interests me, although he would render Gabby Sanchez obsolete. And he is mashing this spring.

Cameron Maybin is on the shelf for a while, so I wonder if a first baseman could be had for an outfielder or maybe Josh Harrison and a pitcher.


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 Post subject: Re: Padres a trading partner?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2014 2:05 pm 
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According to Dejan, the Pirates are set on giving Lambo a shot this spring.

http://triblive.com/sports/dejankovacevic/dejancolumns/5739109-74/lambo-pirates-sports#axzz2vRwmJMV9


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 Post subject: Re: Padres a trading partner?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2014 2:28 pm 
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True. And I like Lambo. But it's not like anyone is really asserting themselves in right field, either. He could be given time there.


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 Post subject: Re: Padres a trading partner?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2014 2:38 pm 
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doug frobel wrote:
True. And I like Lambo. But it's not like anyone is really asserting themselves in right field, either. He could be given time there.


"Not asserting themselves" by what measure? A couple weeks worth of ST ABs don't really mean anything. Tabata more than earned a chance to be the starting RF after posting a career best 119 OPS+ last year and there are quality 4th OF/depth options behind him in Decker, Dickerson and Snider. Not to mention the long-term RF answer will arrive halfway through the season.


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 Post subject: Re: Padres a trading partner?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2014 6:35 pm 
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Things will shake out. They always do. Look, if Snider hits like he showed flashes of, and is hitting this spring, he could ultimately get to 1b when/if Polanco comes up. Heck, Polanco hasn't played a lot at AAA and the Bucs may not rush him until he gets enough AB's there and faces some adversity.

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 Post subject: Re: Padres a trading partner?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2014 11:55 pm 
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ZelieMike wrote:
Look, if Snider hits like he showed flashes of, and is hitting this spring, he could ultimately get to 1b when/if Polanco comes up. Heck, Polanco hasn't played a lot at AAA and the Bucs may not rush him until he gets enough AB's there and faces some adversity.


As usual, that hypothetical makes zero sense to me. I like Snider and have rooted for him since the Lincoln trade. But he barely has a career OPS over .700, and that spans his whole career, not just in relation to last year's injury like some Pirates fans seem to make it out to be. Even if Lambo hits like Brandon Inge or even gets injured, the Pirates would be better suited to promote a 1B from AAA like McGuiness or even Hague than randomly have a below average platoon player like Snider switch to a position he's never played during the season.


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 Post subject: Re: Padres a trading partner?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2014 7:45 am 
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I'll patiently wait while the Pirates give Snider his final chance, but I have no expectation that he's suddenly going to become a good hitter.


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 Post subject: Re: Padres a trading partner?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2014 11:11 am 
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TheShark wrote:
ZelieMike wrote:
Look, if Snider hits like he showed flashes of, and is hitting this spring, he could ultimately get to 1b when/if Polanco comes up. Heck, Polanco hasn't played a lot at AAA and the Bucs may not rush him until he gets enough AB's there and faces some adversity.


As usual, that hypothetical makes zero sense to me. I like Snider and have rooted for him since the Lincoln trade. But he barely has a career OPS over .700, and that spans his whole career, not just in relation to last year's injury like some Pirates fans seem to make it out to be. Even if Lambo hits like Brandon Inge or even gets injured, the Pirates would be better suited to promote a 1B from AAA like McGuiness or even Hague than randomly have a below average platoon player like Snider switch to a position he's never played during the season.


Exactly. Not to mention Snider is really on the short size to be playing 1B. People have called me crazy for suggesting this, but if the Pirates really wanted to make an internal option at 1B to fill in for this year at midseason they could give Polanco a crash course on playing the position for a few weeks in Indy. If they are getting production in RF and not at 1B, Polanco could come at midseason and fill that hole. Then next offseason 1B can be addressed and Polanco would go back to where he belongs. Granted, this isn't likely to happen. But it makes more sense than handing a 1B mitt to a player in the middle of a Major league season and telling him to go out there with absolutely no training or experience at the position.


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 Post subject: Re: Padres a trading partner?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2014 11:22 am 
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Ralphie wrote:
I'll patiently wait while the Pirates give Snider his final chance, but I have no expectation that he's suddenly going to become a good hitter.


He'll probably suck here, then Oakland will sign him and him and Moss will be a dynamic 1-2 punch in their lineup where Snider will hit .275 with 20 HR's.


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 Post subject: Re: Padres a trading partner?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2014 11:43 am 
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Dr. Phibes wrote:
Ralphie wrote:
I'll patiently wait while the Pirates give Snider his final chance, but I have no expectation that he's suddenly going to become a good hitter.


He'll probably suck here, then Oakland will sign him and him and Moss will be a dynamic 1-2 punch in their lineup where Snider will hit .275 with 20 HR's.


Or he'll wind up in Japan and try to steal some playing time from John Bowker.


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 Post subject: Re: Padres a trading partner?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2014 11:54 am 
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mjdouble wrote:
TheShark wrote:
ZelieMike wrote:
Look, if Snider hits like he showed flashes of, and is hitting this spring, he could ultimately get to 1b when/if Polanco comes up. Heck, Polanco hasn't played a lot at AAA and the Bucs may not rush him until he gets enough AB's there and faces some adversity.


As usual, that hypothetical makes zero sense to me. I like Snider and have rooted for him since the Lincoln trade. But he barely has a career OPS over .700, and that spans his whole career, not just in relation to last year's injury like some Pirates fans seem to make it out to be. Even if Lambo hits like Brandon Inge or even gets injured, the Pirates would be better suited to promote a 1B from AAA like McGuiness or even Hague than randomly have a below average platoon player like Snider switch to a position he's never played during the season.


Exactly. Not to mention Snider is really on the short size to be playing 1B. People have called me crazy for suggesting this, but if the Pirates really wanted to make an internal option at 1B to fill in for this year at midseason they could give Polanco a crash course on playing the position for a few weeks in Indy. If they are getting production in RF and not at 1B, Polanco could come at midseason and fill that hole. Then next offseason 1B can be addressed and Polanco would go back to where he belongs. Granted, this isn't likely to happen. But it makes more sense than handing a 1B mitt to a player in the middle of a Major league season and telling him to go out there with absolutely no training or experience at the position.


This is not a crazy idea. Is there a downside? Any route running that he needs to work on in right field? He is certainly athlete enough to learn a position like this.


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 Post subject: Re: Padres a trading partner?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2014 12:06 pm 
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mjdouble wrote:
Or he'll wind up in Japan and try to steal some playing time from John Bowker.


The Yakult Swallows might be a good NPB fit ... even though they were the worst team in the league, they were highlighted by the middle of the line-up of ex-Mariner/Red Wladimer Balentine breaking the prestigious single season HR record (years ago, I had read that it was thought that Japanese players would never let a foreign player break it and pitchers will deliberately pitch around them to protect legend Sadaharu Oh) and Lastings Milledge. Both of them got multi-year extensions. Iwamura is there, too.


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 Post subject: Re: Padres a trading partner?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2014 1:15 pm 
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TheShark wrote:
doug frobel wrote:
True. And I like Lambo. But it's not like anyone is really asserting themselves in right field, either. He could be given time there.


"Not asserting themselves" by what measure? A couple weeks worth of ST ABs don't really mean anything. Tabata more than earned a chance to be the starting RF after posting a career best 119 OPS+ last year and there are quality 4th OF/depth options behind him in Decker, Dickerson and Snider. Not to mention the long-term RF answer will arrive halfway through the season.


Apparently, Tim Williams agrees with me. See first paragraph:

http://www.piratesprospects.com/2014/03 ... lanco.html


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 Post subject: Re: Padres a trading partner?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2014 1:36 pm 
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doug frobel wrote:
Apparently, Tim Williams agrees with me. See first paragraph:

http://www.piratesprospects.com/2014/03 ... lanco.html


Not sure what that has to do with what I said. No one disagrees that Tabata and Snider are questionable placeholders before Polanco gets promoted. I was taking exception with you saying that Lambo could be a RF option when he's currently the only 1B who can hit RHP, and there is depth in RF with Tabata having a very good year last year, Snider likely being the 4th OF, and Decker/Dickerson (arguably stronger options than Snider) in AAA. And if Tabata can stay healthy (a big "if"), I'm confident he'll be a completely serviceable stopgap to Polanco.


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 Post subject: Re: Padres a trading partner?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2014 4:27 pm 
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TheShark wrote:
ZelieMike wrote:
Look, if Snider hits like he showed flashes of, and is hitting this spring, he could ultimately get to 1b when/if Polanco comes up. Heck, Polanco hasn't played a lot at AAA and the Bucs may not rush him until he gets enough AB's there and faces some adversity.


As usual, that hypothetical makes zero sense to me. I like Snider and have rooted for him since the Lincoln trade. But he barely has a career OPS over .700, and that spans his whole career, not just in relation to last year's injury like some Pirates fans seem to make it out to be. Even if Lambo hits like Brandon Inge or even gets injured, the Pirates would be better suited to promote a 1B from AAA like McGuiness or even Hague than randomly have a below average platoon player like Snider switch to a position he's never played during the season.


Do explain the bolded section . . .

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 Post subject: Re: Padres a trading partner?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2014 5:00 pm 
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No. 9 wrote:
Do explain the bolded section . . .


It has been suggested a few times on the board this off-season. And every time it surprises me because I don't think it makes much sense.


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 Post subject: Re: Padres a trading partner?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2014 6:43 pm 
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It is simple really. Bats play. If Snider is hitting and hitting with the patience and power he showed before he was hurt, then they'll find a place for him to play. That may be 1b, if there is a gaping hole there and a productive bat on the bench.

Not likely though.

The whole point was that you wait and see who hits and who doesn't before you make any moves.

ZM

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 Post subject: Re: Padres a trading partner?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2014 7:33 pm 
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mjdouble wrote:
TheShark wrote:
ZelieMike wrote:
Look, if Snider hits like he showed flashes of, and is hitting this spring, he could ultimately get to 1b when/if Polanco comes up. Heck, Polanco hasn't played a lot at AAA and the Bucs may not rush him until he gets enough AB's there and faces some adversity.


As usual, that hypothetical makes zero sense to me. I like Snider and have rooted for him since the Lincoln trade. But he barely has a career OPS over .700, and that spans his whole career, not just in relation to last year's injury like some Pirates fans seem to make it out to be. Even if Lambo hits like Brandon Inge or even gets injured, the Pirates would be better suited to promote a 1B from AAA like McGuiness or even Hague than randomly have a below average platoon player like Snider switch to a position he's never played during the season.


Exactly. Not to mention Snider is really on the short size to be playing 1B. People have called me crazy for suggesting this, but if the Pirates really wanted to make an internal option at 1B to fill in for this year at midseason they could give Polanco a crash course on playing the position for a few weeks in Indy. If they are getting production in RF and not at 1B, Polanco could come at midseason and fill that hole. Then next offseason 1B can be addressed and Polanco would go back to where he belongs. Granted, this isn't likely to happen. But it makes more sense than handing a 1B mitt to a player in the middle of a Major league season and telling him to go out there with absolutely no training or experience at the position.

Moving a plus outfield defender like Polanco to first would be insane.

Snider is 6'-0" tall, plenty tall enough to play first.

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 Post subject: Re: Padres a trading partner?
PostPosted: Sat Mar 15, 2014 2:52 pm 
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sisyphus wrote:
mjdouble wrote:
TheShark wrote:

As usual, that hypothetical makes zero sense to me. I like Snider and have rooted for him since the Lincoln trade. But he barely has a career OPS over .700, and that spans his whole career, not just in relation to last year's injury like some Pirates fans seem to make it out to be. Even if Lambo hits like Brandon Inge or even gets injured, the Pirates would be better suited to promote a 1B from AAA like McGuiness or even Hague than randomly have a below average platoon player like Snider switch to a position he's never played during the season.


Exactly. Not to mention Snider is really on the short size to be playing 1B. People have called me crazy for suggesting this, but if the Pirates really wanted to make an internal option at 1B to fill in for this year at midseason they could give Polanco a crash course on playing the position for a few weeks in Indy. If they are getting production in RF and not at 1B, Polanco could come at midseason and fill that hole. Then next offseason 1B can be addressed and Polanco would go back to where he belongs. Granted, this isn't likely to happen. But it makes more sense than handing a 1B mitt to a player in the middle of a Major league season and telling him to go out there with absolutely no training or experience at the position.

Moving a plus outfield defender like Polanco to first would be insane.

Snider is 6'-0" tall, plenty tall enough to play first.


There are very few 1Bs that are 6 foot or under and I can't think of one that is very good. Height isn't an absolute necessity for the position but not having it is a clear disadvantage. It is really kind of ridiculous how overvalued defensively corner OFs are. Marte is an elite defensive LF. He was a plus +20 in defensive runs saved (DRS). Adam Dunn is a terrible defensive 1B. he was -12 DRS in just over 600 innings last season. Not saying Snider would be worse than Dunn, but I wouldn't want to put him there in the middle of a season with no training to find out. Even if Polanco plays at Marte's level the chance of him making up the difference for a truly terrible 1B is not good. Especially behind this pitching staff that has ground ball rates higher than any team in baseball by a wide margin. Polanco is a gifted athlete. His future is in the OF. But a short term move to fill a hole is hardly insane.


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 Post subject: Re: Padres a trading partner?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 16, 2014 8:34 pm 
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mjdouble wrote:
There are very few 1Bs that are 6 foot or under and I can't think of one that is very good. Height isn't an absolute necessity for the position but not having it is a clear disadvantage. It is really kind of ridiculous how overvalued defensively corner OFs are. Marte is an elite defensive LF. He was a plus +20 in defensive runs saved (DRS). Adam Dunn is a terrible defensive 1B. he was -12 DRS in just over 600 innings last season. Not saying Snider would be worse than Dunn, but I wouldn't want to put him there in the middle of a season with no training to find out. Even if Polanco plays at Marte's level the chance of him making up the difference for a truly terrible 1B is not good. Especially behind this pitching staff that has ground ball rates higher than any team in baseball by a wide margin. Polanco is a gifted athlete. His future is in the OF. But a short term move to fill a hole is hardly insane.

A lot of first basemen are tall because there is nowhere else that you can hide a big, slow-footed slugger.

Jeff Bagwell managed to win a Gold Glove at first. He was six feet tall. Palmiero won three. He was six feet tall. Don Mattingly won nine. He was six feet tall. Keith Hernandez is probably the best defensive first baseman in my lifetime, winning 11 Gold Gloves. He was six feet tall. Steve Garvey won four at 5'-10". Mike Jorgenson and Mike Squires only manged to win one Gold Glove each at 6'-0" and 5'11", primarily because they hit like shortstops and couldn't get on the field as regulars. Their gloves at first were the only skills they had, and that's what kept them in the majors for twenty seven seasons combined. So much for the importance of height when it comes to playing first base.

So generous of you to compare Snider to one of the worst defensive players I've seen in 50 years of watching baseball. The fact is that Snider would likely be a far better glove at first than Dunn.

Polanco is no more likely to be a decent defensive first baseman than Snider; since neither has experience there, you'd have to rate them even until proven otherwise. But we have plenty of evidence as to who is the better outfielder. Snider is certainly good enough in right, but Polanco is far, far better. And right field defense is far more valuable than first base defense.

I'll say it again, any talk of moving Polanco to first base is insane. I doubt that you could find a single person in all of baseball who would agree with you.

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