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 Post subject: Singer says Bucs Will Try to Retain Byrd, Barmes, Burnett
PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2013 4:42 am 
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Morneau, Karstens, Farnsworth, and Buck are on the back burner.

http://mlb.mlblogs.com/2013/10/31/2138849/


Last edited by JollyRoger on Sat Nov 02, 2013 9:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Singer says Bucs Will Try to Retain Byrd, Barmes, and Bu
PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2013 6:18 am 
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Did Singer get his info from this message board?

There's *nothing* in there that's new, just a re-hash of 'they-might-do-this-and-this' speculation.


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 Post subject: Re: Singer says Bucs Will Try to Retain Byrd, Barmes, and Bu
PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2013 10:19 am 
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I don't hate Harmless Barmes like most, at a $1-$2 mil I think he's a good piece to have.

Morneau I doubt would take the one-year $3 mil or so offer I'd give him, so that makes sense, although I would be offering a similar one with incentives to Byrd (can you do that? I'm clearly football first when it comes to contracts).

Buck is pointless for this team, he can go.

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 Post subject: Re: Singer says Bucs Will Try to Retain Byrd, Barmes, and Bu
PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2013 10:47 am 
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Dave Augustine wrote:
There's *nothing* in there that's new, just a re-hash of 'they-might-do-this-and-this' speculation.


Not necessarily, it sheds some light on the fact that Huntington will aggressively pursue resigning Byrd and Barmes before they can test the open market, it was purely speculation previously that Barmes would even be considered back (it of course made sense since there are no internal back-up SS options and he will be so cheap for one year). It's also significant regarding Byrd that the effort is there to resign before he potentially gets a multi-year deal from another year deal that his career best 4.1 WAR year would warrant. Whether or not it will actually mean anything to Byrd is another story.


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 Post subject: Re: Singer says Bucs Will Try to Retain Byrd, Barmes, and Bu
PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2013 10:55 am 
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SUPERCHARGED APE wrote:
I don't hate Harmless Barmes like most, at a $1-$2 mil I think he's a good piece to have.


I think he's the ideal back-up SS to have -- experience, elite glove and cheap. The only downside would be if Hurdle allotted him too much playing time despite that role. 2014 needs to (finally) be the year you see what you have with Mercer rather than jerking him around like the past two years. The year he had at the plate, one of the better offensive shortstops in the league last year already warrants that oppurtunity, now you want to see what kind of defensive improvements can be made over a full season as well. Hanson is still years away and there are 0 other internal options with d'Arnaud slipping into irrelevancy, time to see if Mercer can stick instead of giving Barmes another 300 ABs.


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 Post subject: Re: Singer says Bucs Will Try to Retain Byrd, Barmes, and Bu
PostPosted: Sat Nov 02, 2013 6:26 pm 
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TheShark wrote:
SUPERCHARGED APE wrote:
I don't hate Harmless Barmes like most, at a $1-$2 mil I think he's a good piece to have.


I think he's the ideal back-up SS to have -- experience, elite glove and cheap. The only downside would be if Hurdle allotted him too much playing time despite that role. 2014 needs to (finally) be the year you see what you have with Mercer rather than jerking him around like the past two years. The year he had at the plate, one of the better offensive shortstops in the league last year already warrants that oppurtunity, now you want to see what kind of defensive improvements can be made over a full season as well. Hanson is still years away and there are 0 other internal options with d'Arnaud slipping into irrelevancy, time to see if Mercer can stick instead of giving Barmes another 300 ABs.



If Barmes comes back at his age and at a much reduced salary, I think both he and Hurdle are going to know his role. Mercer deserves his shot to start a majority of the games, Clint is the back up and will get a spot start here and there while Mercer replaces Walker against a tough lefty.

Jordy's earned it.


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 Post subject: Re: Singer says Bucs Will Try to Retain Byrd, Barmes, Burnet
PostPosted: Sun Nov 10, 2013 6:11 pm 
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The killer B's. Lol.

Barmes for starters wouldn't be that bad to resign. He'd be a nice backup to Mercer. If the bucs look to upgrade over Mercer than there's no need for Barmes.

Byrd would fill in nicely if he's willing to except a one year deal at his age but I doubt it. Tabata as the 4th outfielder or a starter if Byrd doesn't come back.

How about trying Lambo at first base? Is Dickerson ready for the show yet?

I'd hope the pirates take a flyer on a veteran pitcher out there somewhere. Josh Johnson?


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 Post subject: Re: Singer says Bucs Will Try to Retain Byrd, Barmes, Burnet
PostPosted: Mon Nov 11, 2013 10:20 am 
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If they sign Byrd I would trade Tabata. I don't want my top 4 outfielders to be righties, especially in a park that favors lefties.

Lambo is a tough call because it's hard to predict what you'll get from him. I would definitely give him a chance but have a backup plan.

Dickerson can't be ready, can he?


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 Post subject: Re: Singer says Bucs Will Try to Retain Byrd, Barmes, Burnet
PostPosted: Mon Nov 11, 2013 11:17 am 
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I'll be interested to see what they do with Byrd. If they do resign him I would not be surprised to see him traded at the deadline.

I do not agree with trading Tabata under any circumstance (barring a ridiculous return for a 4th OF). The Bucs have 3 more years of control with him, he's 25, and he's one of the best 4th OFer types in the game. Marte-Cutch-Polanco with Tabata coming off the bench is pretty attractive to me. If Byrd is not resigned, I would think that Tabata and Lambo can split the RF duties until the assumed Polanco promotion.

Whether Dickerson is ready or not is inconsequential. He will begin next season in the minors. If he hits well again next season I wouldn't be shocked to see him in Pittsburgh in September but I doubt he'll be there any sooner.


Last edited by JollyRoger on Mon Nov 11, 2013 11:38 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Singer says Bucs Will Try to Retain Byrd, Barmes, Burnet
PostPosted: Mon Nov 11, 2013 11:31 am 
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Ralphie wrote:
If they sign Byrd I would trade Tabata.


I don't think there would be any reason to do that unless your socks get knocked off with a great return, and I think it's highly improbable that Tabata would draw anything close to that. Keep your depth. Byrd is only an option for one year if they're able to re-sign him, no guarantee Polanco doesn't take a few months to get comfortable out of the gate. Add in the realities of hypothetical injury troubles you have to prepare for and I don't think you want Lambo being your de facto 4th OF. I also just don't think Tabata is expendable just because his outlook is the perennial 4th OF right now, the guy just put up a 119 OPS+ (by far his career best) at age 25 and is basically a lock for a 340+ OBP. I think you ride that out, you're not likely to replace the production elsewhere or be offered anything superior in return. And he's still going to take in plenty of ABs regardless of who the stater is.


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 Post subject: Re: Singer says Bucs Will Try to Retain Byrd, Barmes, Burnet
PostPosted: Mon Nov 11, 2013 12:58 pm 
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My only problem with Tabata is he plays more like a 33 year old than a 25 year old. He makes a nice 4th OF when healthy. He can't stay healthy though.


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 Post subject: Re: Singer says Bucs Will Try to Retain Byrd, Barmes, Burnet
PostPosted: Mon Nov 11, 2013 1:02 pm 
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He was hurt because he wasn't in shape. Once he got himself in shape, and got over his fear of reinjury, he was one the Buc's best coming down the stretch.

Guys contract and age are too good to give up on. And, he is one of the only ones on this team that knows how to get on base regularly.

ZM

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 Post subject: Re: Singer says Bucs Will Try to Retain Byrd, Barmes, Burnet
PostPosted: Mon Nov 11, 2013 1:55 pm 
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Ralphie wrote:
If they sign Byrd I would trade Tabata. I don't want my top 4 outfielders to be righties, especially in a park that favors lefties.

Lambo is a tough call because it's hard to predict what you'll get from him. I would definitely give him a chance but have a backup plan.

Dickerson can't be ready, can he?


Lambo's numbers at first base are ridiculously awful. Too bad, it would be worth a try. Dickerson is probably a year away.


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 Post subject: Re: Singer says Bucs Will Try to Retain Byrd, Barmes, Burnet
PostPosted: Mon Nov 11, 2013 3:00 pm 
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ZelieMike wrote:
He was hurt because he wasn't in shape. Once he got himself in shape, and got over his fear of reinjury, he was one the Buc's best coming down the stretch.

Guys contract and age are too good to give up on. And, he is one of the only ones on this team that knows how to get on base regularly.

ZM


I heard all spring training about how much better shape he was in. Then he went on the DL for a month with an oblique strain. Missed a few other games later on with knee or ankle injuries but didn't go on the DL. I think the guy is just strung too tight. Tons of lower body issues. Sometimes conditioning ain't enough. Some guys are just susceptible to certain injuries. I think Tabata is one of those guys. I think there is little chance he can go a whole season without at least 1 stint on the DL.


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 Post subject: Re: Singer says Bucs Will Try to Retain Byrd, Barmes, Burnet
PostPosted: Mon Nov 11, 2013 3:14 pm 
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TheShark wrote:
Ralphie wrote:
If they sign Byrd I would trade Tabata.


I don't think there would be any reason to do that unless your socks get knocked off with a great return, and I think it's highly improbable that Tabata would draw anything close to that. Keep your depth. Byrd is only an option for one year if they're able to re-sign him, no guarantee Polanco doesn't take a few months to get comfortable out of the gate. Add in the realities of hypothetical injury troubles you have to prepare for and I don't think you want Lambo being your de facto 4th OF. I also just don't think Tabata is expendable just because his outlook is the perennial 4th OF right now, the guy just put up a 119 OPS+ (by far his career best) at age 25 and is basically a lock for a 340+ OBP. I think you ride that out, you're not likely to replace the production elsewhere or be offered anything superior in return. And he's still going to take in plenty of ABs regardless of who the stater is.


If Tabata is so valuable why not sell high? I gave my reason. I don't want an all right-handed outfield. You don't have to agree with that.

The right handed hitter I want to add will be able to play second and third.


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 Post subject: Re: Singer says Bucs Will Try to Retain Byrd, Barmes, Burnet
PostPosted: Mon Nov 11, 2013 5:24 pm 
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Except that Tabata hits righties like a lefty. So, you point is moot.

ZM

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 Post subject: Re: Singer says Bucs Will Try to Retain Byrd, Barmes, Burnet
PostPosted: Mon Nov 11, 2013 7:09 pm 
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Call it whatever you want, I don't want both Byrd and Tabata on the roster.

Tabata's combined OPS over the last 3 years vs. righties is .701. I'm looking for someone who can do better than that. Or if not, can at least give you more in terms of defense and baserunning.


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 Post subject: Re: Singer says Bucs Will Try to Retain Byrd, Barmes, Burnet
PostPosted: Mon Nov 11, 2013 7:19 pm 
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I agree. We don't have room for both without leaving us short somewhere else.


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 Post subject: Re: Singer says Bucs Will Try to Retain Byrd, Barmes, Burnet
PostPosted: Mon Nov 11, 2013 8:49 pm 
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mjdouble wrote:
My only problem with Tabata is he plays more like a 33 year old than a 25 year old. He makes a nice 4th OF when healthy. He can't stay healthy though.


I'm thinking it's because he's closer to 33 years old than he is to 25 years old.

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 Post subject: Re: Singer says Bucs Will Try to Retain Byrd, Barmes, Burnet
PostPosted: Tue Nov 12, 2013 12:15 am 
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Just go with Tabata until Polanco is ready.

Tabata has a career 104 wRC+ against lefties, 103 against righties. He's cheap and controllable and gives you slightly above average production with the bat. Byrd is 111 and 97, respectively. Both splits are fine for a 4th OF and Byrd's more likely to have had a career year in 2013 than some sort of Renaissance. Add in that he's older and more expensive and just let Tabata keep the spot warm until Polanco is ready in June or July.

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