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 Post subject: St Louis Pitching
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 10:16 am 
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With Wacha, Kelley and Miller, seems the Cards are set for the future in pitching. Don't know how old Wainright is, but nice looking staff.


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 Post subject: Re: St Louis Pitching
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 10:26 am 
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Adam just turned 32.


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 Post subject: Re: St Louis Pitching
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 11:23 am 
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I believe Wainright is signed through 2018.

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 Post subject: Re: St Louis Pitching
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 11:25 am 
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...and Lynn is no slouch either! Going to be very interesting going forward.

And their pen and closer are good too...basically all rookies

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 Post subject: Re: St Louis Pitching
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 12:35 pm 
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The Pirates have some young power arms of their own. By the end of 2014, the rotation could feature Gerrit Cole, Jameson Taillon, Francisco Liriano, and possibly Stolmy Pimentel (who has fantastic stuff). The team may also retain A.J. Burnett and Wandy Rodriguez is likely to exercise his option to return. Add in a well-rested Jeff Locke, solid Charlie Morton, and decent depth option Brandon Cumpton and the Pirates' 2014 staff may run nine starting pitchers deep.


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 Post subject: Re: St Louis Pitching
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 1:28 pm 
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J_C_Steel wrote:
The Pirates have some young power arms of their own. By the end of 2014, the rotation could feature Gerrit Cole, Jameson Taillon, Francisco Liriano, and possibly Stolmy Pimentel (who has fantastic stuff). The team may also retain A.J. Burnett and Wandy Rodriguez is likely to exercise his option to return. Add in a well-rested Jeff Locke, solid Charlie Morton, and decent depth option Brandon Cumpton and the Pirates' 2014 staff may run nine starting pitchers deep.



I agree 100%..not conceding to SL...just saying they are young too, and could be just as awesome.

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 Post subject: Re: St Louis Pitching
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 1:30 pm 
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The Pirates also have 2 very good pitching prospects,one of whom who reach AAA next year:

(1) Nick Kingham, 21 years old, 6'6" right-hander, finished in AA last year with a 2.70 ERA in AA, 2.89 overall minor league ERA, FIP of 2.79, just 1 HR allowed in 73 IP in AA, deals 92-94, can hit 97 on occasion, with a filthy slider and developing change.

(2) Tyler Glasnow, 20 years old, 6'7" right-hander, 2.18 ERA in A-ball, 164 K's in 111 IP, 54 H's allowed, deals in the upper 90's with a wipeout curveball. He needs to reduce his HR's allowed and fly ball ratio in general, but any time a kid deals 98 mph with a wipeout breaking ball and fans three times the number of hits allowed, it is good.


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 Post subject: Re: St Louis Pitching
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 1:54 pm 
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I'd also remind the crowd that Kyle McPherson and Phil Irwin should be back up and running soon.

ZM

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 Post subject: Re: St Louis Pitching
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 2:07 pm 
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I like the Pirates' offense long term over the Cards, believe it or not. Very young, equal or better prospects, lots of control. Pitching should be very strong for both, though.

Cards are a good team but that offense isn't infallible. We sucked yesterday, but they only squeaked out 3 hits themselves.

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 Post subject: Re: St Louis Pitching
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 2:19 pm 
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StarlingArcher wrote:
I like the Pirates' offense long term over the Cards, believe it or not. Very young, equal or better prospects, lots of control. Pitching should be very strong for both, though.

Cards are a good team but that offense isn't infallible. We sucked yesterday, but they only squeaked out 3 hits themselves.


Beltran's likely gone, Holliday and Molina are getting long in the tooth, and Carpenter probably had his career year in 2013.

Other than Oscar Taveras and Kolten Wong, I don't see many impact bats.


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 Post subject: Re: St Louis Pitching
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 2:39 pm 
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That's my thought as well. Plus Freese is 30 and showing some of that age 30 decline and Jon Jay just sucks. Didn't realize Carpenter is 27. So he's in his prime already. Allen Craig will be 30 next year too.

So with Polanco shortening the gap between he and Taveras I'm confident in saying that Polanco-Hanson is, at minimum, equal to Taveras-Wong. Mostly because Wong's never been regarded on the same level as Hanson.

And that's only considering guys likely to be up in a year or two. Meadows is blowing up and I think McGuire, Bell, and Dickerson are showing encouraging signs at their respective levels. Plus you have Harold Ramirez. Lots of breakout candidates.

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 Post subject: Re: St Louis Pitching
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 3:21 pm 
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Good discussion, as it underscores the incredible importance of significant, top-end minor league talent to keep a team like the Bucs competitive for the long term.

Pirates will have a top-5 system, perhaps as high as No. 4. :D

Problem is, of course, that the Cardinals also have a top-4 system. :(


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 Post subject: Re: St Louis Pitching
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 3:29 pm 
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I'd like to see the Pirates develop a dominant left-handed starter. If Blake Taylor can zip through the system, I'd be psyched. PNC Park plays so well for an excellent LHP.


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 Post subject: Re: St Louis Pitching
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 3:46 pm 
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Curiously though, several of the guys who built that system have been let go by the Cards this year. Could they be shooting themselves in the foot to become "more sabre" as they've made reference to recently (see "shifts")

ZM

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 Post subject: Re: St Louis Pitching
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 4:01 pm 
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Nah they've been regarded as SABR heavy for a while. Plus that stuff doesn't come into play quite as much with drafting and developing. You can't really extrapolate stats from HS to the MLB level.

It can help with identifying the type of player you want to target, though. And they've definitely done a solid job of that. Much like the Pirates with their pitchers and outfielders, the Cards definitely have a type that they target.

I do think they took a hit when they lost Luhnow though. He's built up the Astros system in no time and was a part of some great drafts in St. Louis.

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 Post subject: Re: St Louis Pitching
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 5:32 pm 
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StarlingArcher wrote:
That's my thought as well. Plus Freese is 30 and showing some of that age 30 decline and Jon Jay just sucks. Didn't realize Carpenter is 27. So he's in his prime already. Allen Craig will be 30 next year too.

So with Polanco shortening the gap between he and Taveras I'm confident in saying that Polanco-Hanson is, at minimum, equal to Taveras-Wong. Mostly because Wong's never been regarded on the same level as Hanson.

And that's only considering guys likely to be up in a year or two. Meadows is blowing up and I think McGuire, Bell, and Dickerson are showing encouraging signs at their respective levels. Plus you have Harold Ramirez. Lots of breakout candidates.


I imagine that Craig or Adams will be playing 3b next year!

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 Post subject: Re: St Louis Pitching
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 6:18 pm 
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Nah, they'll just sprinkle their pixie dust on some young kid from the Dominican and walaaa... new 3b.

ZM

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 Post subject: Re: St Louis Pitching
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 7:41 pm 
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Animal wrote:
I imagine that Craig or Adams will be playing 3b next year!

Okay, that would be funny.


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 Post subject: Re: St Louis Pitching
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 8:23 pm 
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Here's a list of players at instructs - I think we have some good talent in this mix

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 Post subject: Re: St Louis Pitching
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 9:13 pm 
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Bucfan wrote:
Animal wrote:
I imagine that Craig or Adams will be playing 3b next year!

Okay, that would be funny.


Why funny? Not sure of your implication? Craig played more 3b in the minors than anything. Actually he played much more 3b AND OF than he did 1b. It would certainly be him moving, not Adams.

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