Proud fans of a 128-year old tradition

It is currently Sat Nov 01, 2014 5:28 am

All times are UTC - 4 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 82 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Pirates Sign Craig Monroe and Miguel Perez
PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2009 6:00 pm 
Offline
 Profile

Joined: Sat Apr 26, 2008 4:26 pm
Posts: 3006
Kingston wrote:
Argentum wrote:
Well, unless you know Huntington personally, you're probably not going to get an answer to that question. I consider it rhetorical.


Huh? Of course we're gonna get an answer to that question. If he doesnt make an offer to anyone else between now and opening day then hes satisfied.


Aside from the fact that he could make offers that we never hear about it, this statement just isn't true. If he doesn't make any more offers it means that he wasn't able to find any better alternatives that he thought were a reasonable value. It doesn't mean that he is satisfied with what he has, just that he can't get anything better.

My sense is that NH has failed to land his RH power bat and moved on to plan B- sign a RH 4th outfielder to give us more options. It doesn't mean he views his solution to plan B as a satisfactory answer to plan A.


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: Pirates Sign Craig Monroe and Miguel Perez
PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2009 6:06 pm 
Offline
 Profile

Joined: Thu Dec 04, 2008 5:16 pm
Posts: 637
BBF wrote:
Kingston wrote:
Argentum wrote:
Well, unless you know Huntington personally, you're probably not going to get an answer to that question. I consider it rhetorical.


Huh? Of course we're gonna get an answer to that question. If he doesnt make an offer to anyone else between now and opening day then hes satisfied.


Aside from the fact that he could make offers that we never hear about it, this statement just isn't true. If he doesn't make any more offers it means that he wasn't able to find any better alternatives that he thought were a reasonable value. It doesn't mean that he is satisfied with what he has, just that he can't get anything better.

My sense is that NH has failed to land his RH power bat and moved on to plan B- sign a RH 4th outfielder to give us more options. It doesn't mean he views his solution to plan B as a satisfactory answer to plan A.


Well sure, circumstances dictate why a GM would be satisfied. If hes satisfied that Craig Monroe is the most reasonable value to be had, then hes satisfied. But youll excuse me if I dont believe that Craig Monroe is the best he could do, for whatever reason.


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: Pirates Sign Craig Monroe and Miguel Perez
PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2009 6:27 pm 
Offline
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Sat Apr 26, 2008 6:18 pm
Posts: 5060
Location: Scotch Plains, NJ
ZelieMike wrote:
What were your thoughts, if any, regarding the Rays signing of Pena a few years ago?

You assume Monroe is done. NH has said he is looking for a "bounce back" guy. Like Pena, Monroe fits that mold, possibly. And under a minor league contract, who cares?

ZM

Pena was a considerably different case compared to Monroe. Pena was able to control the strike zone while hitting for power. There's little evidence that Monroe knows where the strike zone is. Monroe is filler, plain and simple.

_________________
"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong."
~H. L. Mencken


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: Pirates Sign Craig Monroe and Miguel Perez
PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2009 6:28 pm 
Offline
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Sat Apr 26, 2008 6:18 pm
Posts: 5060
Location: Scotch Plains, NJ
VanSlick wrote:
I'm really, really trying to stay positive and trust Huntington's grand scheme of things. But man, are signings like this really going to put butts in the seats and help add revenue for the future?

Not likely.

Signings like this are not supposed to do that.

_________________
"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong."
~H. L. Mencken


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: Pirates Sign Craig Monroe and Miguel Perez
PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2009 7:10 pm 
Offline
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2008 2:48 am
Posts: 391
Welcome to the Dark Side Kingston, I'm with you on this one. I'm thinking Monroe is going to be our starting RF.
I don't get it. For the love of god make someone an offer, at least make it look like you're not trying to lose 110 games.

_________________
"What other businesses do you expect to lose money for your entertainment?"-- UPPMB


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: Pirates Sign Craig Monroe and Miguel Perez
PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2009 7:23 pm 
Offline
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Sat Apr 26, 2008 6:18 pm
Posts: 5060
Location: Scotch Plains, NJ
omgardd wrote:
Welcome to the Dark Side Kingston, I'm with you on this one. I'm thinking Monroe is going to be our starting RF.
I don't get it. For the love of god make someone an offer, at least make it look like you're not trying to lose 110 games.

I'm pretty sure that's not what Kingston is saying.

_________________
"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong."
~H. L. Mencken


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: Pirates Sign Craig Monroe and Miguel Perez
PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2009 8:14 pm 
Offline
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Sun Apr 27, 2008 7:01 pm
Posts: 7275
omgardd wrote:
Welcome to the Dark Side Kingston, I'm with you on this one. I'm thinking Monroe is going to be our starting RF.
I don't get it. For the love of god make someone an offer, at least make it look like you're not trying to lose 110 games.


If Monroe is the starting RFer to start 2009 that would mean that Pearce and Moss both stunk up Bradenton...He got a minor league deal with an invite to camp, that doesnt mean he's being written into the 25 man roster yet...if anything he's the 4th OFer taking Michaels' spot...oh no!!!

_________________
I say keep the $50 and ban him anyway...

For those jumping ship, we'll keep the bandwagon warm for you...


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: Pirates Sign Craig Monroe and Miguel Perez
PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2009 8:59 pm 
Offline
 Profile

Joined: Thu Dec 04, 2008 5:16 pm
Posts: 637
Apparantly my posts have taken on an ambiguity not seen since Mona Lisa's smile. ;)


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: Pirates Sign Craig Monroe and Miguel Perez
PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2009 9:34 pm 
Offline
 Profile

Joined: Sat Apr 26, 2008 5:28 pm
Posts: 1361
I didn't know she was ambiguous! Did she switch-hit? But seriously, you kinda limited the argument or discussion on the topic by saying "Don't tell me it's just a minor league deal" because that IS the counter-point. IF you are right that NH is satisfied with this as his answer to a right-handed power bat, then I can agree with you. But that is a big IF and we won't know until he either says it was the just the guy he wanted or, as BBF said, he explains it as just an insurance policy deal in case he can't do better.


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: Pirates Sign Craig Monroe and Miguel Perez
PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2009 9:38 pm 
Offline
 Profile

Joined: Thu Dec 04, 2008 5:16 pm
Posts: 637
bradf wrote:
I didn't know she was ambiguous! Did she switch-hit? But seriously, you kinda limited the argument or discussion on the topic by saying "Don't tell me it's just a minor league deal" because that IS the counter-point. IF you are right that NH is satisfied with this as his answer to a right-handed power bat, then I can agree with you. But that is a big IF and we won't know until he either says it was the just the guy he wanted or, as BBF said, he explains it as just an insurance policy deal in case he can't do better.


Actually, I didnt think I was limiting the argument as much as conceding a reasonable point.


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: Pirates Sign Craig Monroe and Miguel Perez
PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2009 9:41 pm 
Offline
 Profile

Joined: Sat Apr 26, 2008 5:28 pm
Posts: 1361
Fair enough....15-love Kingston


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: Pirates Sign Craig Monroe and Miguel Perez
PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2009 9:51 pm 
Offline
 Profile

Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2008 6:38 pm
Posts: 28
Willton wrote:
ZelieMike wrote:
What were your thoughts, if any, regarding the Rays signing of Pena a few years ago?

You assume Monroe is done. NH has said he is looking for a "bounce back" guy. Like Pena, Monroe fits that mold, possibly. And under a minor league contract, who cares?

ZM

Pena was a considerably different case compared to Monroe. Pena was able to control the strike zone while hitting for power. There's little evidence that Monroe knows where the strike zone is. Monroe is filler, plain and simple.



Thank you for addressing that comment from the first page, comparing Carlos Pena to Craig Monroe is not really fair at all. Carlos Pena had incredible minor league numbers and had always hit for power in the majors before the Rays signed him. Craig Monroe really had not experienced anywhere near the level of success Pena had experienced at any level of the minors or majors. Count me in as one of those who really hopes this does not mark the end of the Pirate's offseason moves. I agree there is no need to bring in big money free agents (or even mid-money free agents for that matter), but the team needs a right fielder to help the young guys develop and they also need help in the bullpen.


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: Pirates Sign Craig Monroe and Miguel Perez
PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2009 10:03 pm 
Offline
 Profile

Joined: Sat Apr 26, 2008 4:22 pm
Posts: 2495
Kingston wrote:
Actually, I didnt think I was limiting the argument as much as conceding a reasonable point.


Well, if you concede the only reasonable point, what's left for discussion?


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: Pirates Sign Craig Monroe and Miguel Perez
PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2009 10:10 pm 
Offline
 Profile

Joined: Sat Apr 26, 2008 4:26 pm
Posts: 3006
You know, WHYGAVS makes a good point. Everyone, including people here, thought Michaels was a good fit last year, some even thought he should be re-signed. Yet, a lot of those same people are now bitching about Monroe, who is THE EXACT SAME PLAYER...less OBP, more SLG.

Michaels: .228/.300/.382/8hr/9 2b

Monroe: .202/.274/.405/8hr/9 2b

I didn't like Michaels and I don't like Monroe, but it is hardly like this is a huge step backwards. Let's just all agree to hope there is no reason Monroe ever sees our big league roster.


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: Pirates Sign Craig Monroe and Miguel Perez
PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2009 10:12 pm 
Offline
 Profile

Joined: Thu Dec 04, 2008 5:16 pm
Posts: 637
Argentum wrote:
Kingston wrote:
Actually, I didnt think I was limiting the argument as much as conceding a reasonable point.


Well, if you concede the only reasonable point, what's left for discussion?


The other only reasonable point. :)


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: Pirates Sign Craig Monroe and Miguel Perez
PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2009 10:23 pm 
Offline
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: Sat Jun 21, 2008 5:32 pm
Posts: 3173
Location: Darlington, Pennsylvania
BBF wrote:
You know, WHYGAVS makes a good point. Everyone, including people here, thought Michaels was a good fit last year, some even thought he should be re-signed. Yet, a lot of those same people are now bitching about Monroe, who is THE EXACT SAME PLAYER...less OBP, more SLG.

Michaels: .228/.300/.382/8hr/9 2b

Monroe: .202/.274/.405/8hr/9 2b

I didn't like Michaels and I don't like Monroe, but it is hardly like this is a huge step backwards. Let's just all agree to hope there is no reason Monroe ever sees our big league roster.


I think its a decent signing for the price we got Monroe for.He could be a 31 year old sleeper.As dumb as that sounds i truely believe he will make the roster and be one of our best bench guys and a spot starter at this point if we don't sign anyone else


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: Pirates Sign Craig Monroe and Miguel Perez
PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2009 10:46 pm 
Offline
 Profile

Joined: Sat Apr 26, 2008 4:22 pm
Posts: 2495
Kingston wrote:
Argentum wrote:
Kingston wrote:
Actually, I didnt think I was limiting the argument as much as conceding a reasonable point.


Well, if you concede the only reasonable point, what's left for discussion?


The other only reasonable point. :)


Ah, BH may have to get back to you on that one then. :P


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: Pirates Sign Craig Monroe and Miguel Perez
PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2009 10:51 pm 
Offline
 Profile

Joined: Sat Apr 26, 2008 4:22 pm
Posts: 2495
BBF wrote:
You know, WHYGAVS makes a good point. Everyone, including people here, thought Michaels was a good fit last year, some even thought he should be re-signed. Yet, a lot of those same people are now bitching about Monroe, who is THE EXACT SAME PLAYER...less OBP, more SLG.

Michaels: .228/.300/.382/8hr/9 2b

Monroe: .202/.274/.405/8hr/9 2b

I didn't like Michaels and I don't like Monroe, but it is hardly like this is a huge step backwards. Let's just all agree to hope there is no reason Monroe ever sees our big league roster.


Propping up Monroe using Michaels? That's damning with ultra faint praise. Two guys well under average replacement level players. I've been pushing for Minky, RH bat be damned! Give me someone capable of being at least average.


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: Pirates Sign Craig Monroe and Miguel Perez
PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2009 10:52 pm 
Offline
 Profile

Joined: Thu Dec 04, 2008 5:16 pm
Posts: 637
LOL. I think Ive established my credentials around here. Im pretty sure you know that Im not an organization basher and that I believe in the direction we're being taken in.


Top
 
 Post subject: Re: Pirates Sign Craig Monroe and Miguel Perez
PostPosted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 1:08 am 
Offline
User avatar
 WWW  YIM  Profile

Joined: Sat Apr 26, 2008 7:24 pm
Posts: 4242
Location: Zelienople, PA
IronKett25 wrote:
Willton wrote:
Pena was a considerably different case compared to Monroe. Pena was able to control the strike zone while hitting for power. There's little evidence that Monroe knows where the strike zone is. Monroe is filler, plain and simple.



Thank you for addressing that comment from the first page, comparing Carlos Pena to Craig Monroe is not really fair at all. .


You both miss the point, entirely.

ZM

_________________
Someone tell Votto... rbis are good


Top
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 82 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next

All times are UTC - 4 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], Google [Bot] and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group  
Design By Poker Bandits