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 Post subject: Justin Morneau
PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:05 pm 
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ESPN Radio reported that the Pirates and Twins are very close to a deal that would send Morneau to the Bucs for a Minor Leaguer, a veteran and some cash. The report used the always reliable term "sources close to the Pirates" for their information. Sources went on to say that the deal could be done in time for Morneau to join the Pirates in San Fransisco.


That means...(If theres any validity to that) that Garrett Jones would be headed to Minnesota. Morneau is a rental player as he is unrestricted in 2014.


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 Post subject: Re: Justin Morneau
PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:11 pm 
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That can't be right, there's no way the Pirates kick in cash.

This would at least give Neal Huntington the "hey, I did something" card if they wind up in a Wild Card. Even with his August hot streak he's a wash with Jones thus far this year.

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 Post subject: Re: Justin Morneau
PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:13 pm 
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Interesting. I'm thinking the veteran could be in AAA? If this deal happens I'd still like Jones here, platooning with Tabata in RF.

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 Post subject: Re: Justin Morneau
PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:13 pm 
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Jones has been absolutely maddening at times and there is no shortage of times that I've yelled at the TV after one of his weak-ass swings but . . . he's been with the Bucs during some really bad times and I don't find much joy if he is traded away just as the team is truly competing for post-season play. If he is traded to the Twins, I'll feel bad for him.

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 Post subject: Re: Justin Morneau
PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:13 pm 
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Worth a shot if it's nobody of any importance. Before this August hot streak, Morneau was bad. He still homers as often as Garrett Jones, a guy who doesn't hit enough homers.

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 Post subject: Re: Justin Morneau
PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:15 pm 
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No. 9 wrote:
Jones has been absolutely maddening at times and there is no shortage of times that I've yelled at the TV after one of his weak-ass swings but . . . he's been with the Bucs during some really bad times and I don't find much joy if he is traded away just as the team is truly competing for post-season play. If he is traded to the Twins, I'll feel bad for him.


^^^This. I'd feel awful for the guy. It's a business and I'd be glad for the upgrade but I won't be jumping up and down.

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 Post subject: Re: Justin Morneau
PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:21 pm 
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StarlingArcher wrote:
That can't be right, there's no way the Pirates kick in cash.

This would at least give Neal Huntington the "hey, I did something" card if they wind up in a Wild Card. Even with his August hot streak he's a wash with Jones thus far this year.


Jones plays at Lefty friendly PNC....Morneau plays in a Lefty eater in Minnesota. I listened to Dan Patrick say that Minnesota said they would honor the wishes of Morneau if he was unwilling to go to Pittsburgh, however if Morneau likes money he would be wise to try and finish strong in a lefty friendly park. He is unrestricted in 14 and could use a strong finish for himself as much as the Pirates could use that as well.

The Cash would simply be tossed in to take some sting out of an arbitration eligible Jones Contract. Just a guess on my part.

Also i looked at the Twins active roster and Morneau is the only player listed as a first basemen.


Last edited by The Rotten One on Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Justin Morneau
PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:24 pm 
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Nah, PNC has a park factor of 95 for lefties. It's not as hellish as it is on righties, but it still plays below a neutral park for lefty HR.

Twins could also non-tender him. Morneau makes 3M over the last 40 days of the season....Jones likely won't make that in arbitration next year (he makes 2.25M this year in total). There's no way we'd kick in cash for Morneau.

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 Post subject: Re: Justin Morneau
PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:25 pm 
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StarlingArcher wrote:
That can't be right, there's no way the Pirates kick in cash.

This would at least give Neal Huntington the "hey, I did something" card if they wind up in a Wild Card. Even with his August hot streak he's a wash with Jones thus far this year.


Morneau's glove >>>>>>>> Jones' glove

Since he'd be playing first base as part of a platoon with Sanchez, one would think that comparing Morneau's stats v. Jones' stats against right handed pitching would be the relevant comparison.

Jones has 330 ABs against right handed pitchers this year; Morneau has 321 ABs against right handed pitchers.

Morneau: http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/7063/splits
Jones: http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/8024/splits

You can look at the numbers and reach your own conclusions if the bat is a "wash."

Maybe Travis Snider is the "other player."

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 Post subject: Re: Justin Morneau
PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:26 pm 
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Jones is projected to make between $5 million and $6.5 million next year through the arbitration process. You should know how arbitration works, StarlingArcher.


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 Post subject: Re: Justin Morneau
PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:29 pm 
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Quote:
Jones likely won't make that in arbitration next year (he makes 2.25M this year in total). There's no way we'd kick in cash for Morneau.


Updated: January 18, 2013, 9:22 PM ET
Associated Press

PITTSBURGH -- First basemen Garrett Jones and Gaby Sanchez have agreed to one-year contracts with the Pittsburgh Pirates, while second baseman Neil Walker and right-hander James McDonald swapped proposed salaries with the team in arbitration.
Jones, who also plays right field, got a raise from $2.25 million to $4.5 million after losing last winter in arbitration, where he had asked for $2.5 million. He hit .274 with a career-high 27 homers and 86 RBIs, which matched his 2006 total.


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 Post subject: Re: Justin Morneau
PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:29 pm 
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The Rotten One wrote:
Also i looked at the Twins active roster and Morneau is the only player listed as a first basemen.


;)
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 Post subject: Re: Justin Morneau
PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:31 pm 
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OPS difference versus RHP -- Morneau .832, Jones .742.

That's significant, folks.


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 Post subject: Re: Justin Morneau
PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:31 pm 
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The Rotten One wrote:
Quote:
Jones likely won't make that in arbitration next year (he makes 2.25M this year in total). There's no way we'd kick in cash for Morneau.


Updated: January 18, 2013, 9:22 PM ET
Associated Press

PITTSBURGH -- First basemen Garrett Jones and Gaby Sanchez have agreed to one-year contracts with the Pittsburgh Pirates, while second baseman Neil Walker and right-hander James McDonald swapped proposed salaries with the team in arbitration.
Jones, who also plays right field, got a raise from $2.25 million to $4.5 million after losing last winter in arbitration, where he had asked for $2.5 million. He hit .274 with a career-high 27 homers and 86 RBIs, which matched his 2006 total.


Mother f*cker. Thanks, google.

Yeah he might make 5M with the courtesy bump. Arbitration heavily rewards HR and his has plummeted. Still, Pirates wouldn't have to kick in cash since Jones is an easy non-tender.

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 Post subject: Re: Justin Morneau
PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:32 pm 
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J_C_Steel wrote:
OPS difference versus RHP -- Morneau .832, Jones .742.

That's significant, folks.


It's not.

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 Post subject: Re: Justin Morneau
PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:33 pm 
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StarlingArcher wrote:
J_C_Steel wrote:
OPS difference versus RHP -- Morneau .832, Jones .742.

That's significant, folks.


It's not.


90 points of OPS and 44 points of OBP are not significant? Really?


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 Post subject: Re: Justin Morneau
PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:35 pm 
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You have to also keep in mind that Jones is a 5 year player after this season which will mean that the Pirates will no longer have any options left with him.


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 Post subject: Re: Justin Morneau
PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:35 pm 
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And oh yeah, as No. 9 mentions above, Morneau's got a better glove, too. Aren't you a guy who believes in defense, StarlingArcher?

;)


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 Post subject: Re: Justin Morneau
PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:37 pm 
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According to StarlingArcher, it's a "wash" if one player posts an OBP of .346 and another player posts an OBP of .302. No real difference there.

Riiiiiiiiiight.


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 Post subject: Re: Justin Morneau
PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:38 pm 
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Not really. Not over such a tiny window. Less than a win in the aggregate and disconcerting when the number discrepancy is based on a 2 week stretch.

Don't really buy the glove is that much better. Morneau has a -0.2 UZR/150 and Jones has a -0.8 UZR/150. That's pretty minor at even a defensive premium position and inconsequential at a place like 1B.

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Last edited by StarlingArcher on Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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