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 Post subject: Re: Kendrys Morales
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 3:24 pm 
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Ralphie wrote:
Why would anyone even look at Harrison's current batting average to evaluate him? He's had like 12 at bats. Look at his AAA numbers if you want to evaluate him, where he's had almost 300 at bats.


Actually considering he has had almost 500 Major League PAs in his career and wasn't the kind of prospect that had a lot of upside, that's what you look at. He's beyond the point where we should be put a lot of value into what he is doing in his fifth or sixth trip to AAA. You expect him to hit in the minors at this point. His lone asset in the Majors considering his defense not being very impressive should be hitting for average which he has proved he cannot do, not to mention the plate discipline which is bad even beyond this team's standards. Yes I'd take him over Inge but I can't imagine any situation where I'd want either of them on the roster. If they want to stick with a player like Harrison as opposed to bringing up a different type utility player like Canzler or carry a 5th OF, it should be DeJesus who should get a shot at that role instead.


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 Post subject: Re: Kendrys Morales
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 3:25 pm 
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Morales would be in there every game, he's a switch hitter who is hitting both sides of the plate pretty well.

He also has nice career numbers in the month of August.

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 Post subject: Re: Kendrys Morales
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 3:27 pm 
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ZelieMike wrote:
Reading some of this and I am seeing classic give up. Think Moss and Bautista here. Snider should not be put out to pasture, but moved to the 5th OF this year.

Morales puts Jones in RF as the LH bat option. And allows you to still platoon at 1b with Gaby, but allows Gaby to focus on what he is good at... hitting lefties.

If you work Cansler into the mix in a limited role, you now have viable options off the bench, and fill in a gap in the 5 hole with Morales.

ZM


Ding, ding, ding. We have a winner.
I'm betting good money this is exactly what the Bucco brass are contemplating when considering trading for Morales.

Inge - DFA.
RF - Jones/Tabata combination
1B - Morales
PH/Defensive Replacements - Snider/Sanchez

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 Post subject: Re: Kendrys Morales
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 3:31 pm 
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No. 9 wrote:
ZelieMike wrote:
Reading some of this and I am seeing classic give up. Think Moss and Bautista here. Snider should not be put out to pasture, but moved to the 5th OF this year.

Morales puts Jones in RF as the LH bat option. And allows you to still platoon at 1b with Gaby, but allows Gaby to focus on what he is good at... hitting lefties.

If you work Cansler into the mix in a limited role, you now have viable options off the bench, and fill in a gap in the 5 hole with Morales.

ZM


Ding, ding, ding. We have a winner.
I'm betting good money this is exactly what the Bucco brass are contemplating when considering trading for Morales.

Inge - DFA.
RF - Jones/Tabata combination
1B - Morales
PH/Defensive Replacements - Snider/Sanchez


Hurdle may pee himself with the chance at using Snider as a decoy pinch hitter to bring a lefty in the game and then send Sanchez up to the plate instead.

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 Post subject: Re: Kendrys Morales
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 3:32 pm 
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No. 9 wrote:
ZelieMike wrote:
Reading some of this and I am seeing classic give up. Think Moss and Bautista here. Snider should not be put out to pasture, but moved to the 5th OF this year.

Morales puts Jones in RF as the LH bat option. And allows you to still platoon at 1b with Gaby, but allows Gaby to focus on what he is good at... hitting lefties.

If you work Cansler into the mix in a limited role, you now have viable options off the bench, and fill in a gap in the 5 hole with Morales.

ZM


Ding, ding, ding. We have a winner.
I'm betting good money this is exactly what the Bucco brass are contemplating when considering trading for Morales.

Inge - DFA.
RF - Jones/Tabata combination
1B - Morales
PH/Defensive Replacements - Snider/Sanchez


That's probably how it shakes out. I'd be fine with that.


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 Post subject: Re: Kendrys Morales
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 3:36 pm 
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I just don't see him making a big difference. Good player, he'd help, wouldn't turn anything around though. He'd be cheap but I don't think he'd solve anything one way or the other besides perception.

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 Post subject: Re: Kendrys Morales
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 3:48 pm 
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Not to mention, Jones and Tabata in right is a terrible platoon because neither is good against lefties. So we still have that hole that's probably more gaping. The Jones/Sanchez platoon isn't outstanding but they're creating runs 5% better than league average and have combined for 15 home runs. Maybe Jones is washed up, I'm not convinced he isn't, but that'd be a pretty strong move that'd signal his end here because he'd have no role.

Still think a guy to platoon with Tabata is most important, unless Jones is done. I haven't exactly made up my mind on that.

Martin's come back to earth with the bat, but obviously you can't replace him.

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 Post subject: Re: Kendrys Morales
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 3:59 pm 
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FWIW, he'd only cost 2 C-level pitching prospects so I'm not against the price. Just not sure how much he adds over 2 months and I don't know how I feel about cutting Jones or Snider for him (since one of them loses his role). I'm not against cutting them, I just am constantly wavering on whether they have any hopes of turning it around in the future.

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 Post subject: Re: Kendrys Morales
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 4:06 pm 
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StarlingArcher wrote:
Maybe Jones is washed up, I'm not convinced he isn't, but that'd be a pretty strong move that'd signal his end here because he'd have no role.


Couldn't disagree more. It is a signal that the Bucs have lost confidence that Snider's bat will return between now and the end of the year and, as a result, the Bucs are moving a more reliable left-handed bat in Jones to RF. The Bucs would essentially be inserting Morales as a regular, platooning Tabata and Jones based upon match-ups and Sanchez/Snider see their roles diminished to a significant extent.

If the Bucs didn't think that Jones' bat would play well through the rest of the season, Snider would still be in the platoon discussion for RF. I'm betting serious money that he's not. No way that Snider would see playing time ahead of Jones. Even with Jones' recent struggles, he's making better contact and looks much more comfortable at the plate than Snider. Snider looks lost.

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 Post subject: Re: Kendrys Morales
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 4:10 pm 
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No. 9 wrote:
StarlingArcher wrote:
Maybe Jones is washed up, I'm not convinced he isn't, but that'd be a pretty strong move that'd signal his end here because he'd have no role.


Couldn't disagree more. It is a signal that the Bucs have lost confidence that Snider's bat will return between now and the end of the year and, as a result, the Bucs are moving a more reliable left-handed bat in Jones to RF. The Bucs would essentially be inserting Morales as a regular, platooning Tabata and Jones based upon match-ups and Sanchez/Snider see their roles diminished to a significant extent.

If the Bucs didn't think that Jones' bat would play well through the rest of the season, Snider would still be in the platoon discussion for RF. I'm betting serious money that he's not. No way that Snider would see playing time ahead of Jones. Even with Jones' recent struggles, he's making better contact and looks much more comfortable at the plate than Snider. Snider looks lost.


But Tabata isn't a platoon candidate with Jones and Snider. That's my point. He doesn't hit lefties well either.

You need to cut either Jones or Snider in that situation because they'd either need to pair a guy who can hit lefties with Tabata or Jose is getting all of the cuts there and it makes no sense to have 2 backup RF. Only reason I'm mentioning Jones as the guy we'd let go is because there seemed to be a consensus that we didn't want Snider to maybe be Moss or Bautista redux.

Or, if you pair Morales with Jose on days we see lefties and play Gaby at 1st and Morales in right, you're still never using one of Jones or Snider.

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Last edited by StarlingArcher on Tue Jul 16, 2013 4:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Kendrys Morales
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 4:12 pm 
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Maybe Jones or Tabata would be part of the trade?

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 Post subject: Re: Kendrys Morales
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 4:19 pm 
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nad69dan wrote:
Maybe Jones or Tabata would be part of the trade?


Jones could be if we want to bring back some prospects, but that still entails getting rid of him. Which I'm not totally opposed to, I really just can't decide if I think he's officially in his 30-year old decline or not.

If he is, he's likely not back next year anyway so why not just rent Morales for this stretch? But if this is just a bad stretch, I'd kind of like to keep him just for the control aspect.

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 Post subject: Re: Kendrys Morales
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 4:29 pm 
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StarlingArcher wrote:
nad69dan wrote:
Maybe Jones or Tabata would be part of the trade?


Jones could be if we want to bring back some prospects, but that still entails getting rid of him. Which I'm not totally opposed to, I really just can't decide if I think he's officially in his 30-year old decline or not.

If he is, he's likely not back next year anyway so why not just rent Morales for this stretch? But if this is just a bad stretch, I'd kind of like to keep him just for the control aspect.


He's 32 and I think he is on his way down...

What I like about Morales is his August numbers. He has an OPS of 1.037 in August, .355 average, .384 onbase %, .653 slugging %, 18 HR's, 54 RBI in 65 games.

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 Post subject: Re: Kendrys Morales
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 4:38 pm 
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Jones for Morales...straight up...would Seattle do it? :shock: :shock: :shock:


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 Post subject: Re: Kendrys Morales
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 5:31 pm 
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StarlingArcher wrote:
I just don't see him making a big difference. Good player, he'd help, wouldn't turn anything around though. He'd be cheap but I don't think he'd solve anything one way or the other besides perception.


You're looking at things wrong. The Pirates aren't going to be able to add Miguel Cabrera, Mike Trout, or Giancarlo Stanton. It's not happening. But Kendrys Morales would make the team better and deeper, and he could be worth anywhere from 1 to 2 extra wins in the second half. Given that the Pirates are in a pennant race, those 1 or 2 extra wins could mean the difference between "word that rhymes with tradeoffs" and going home for the fall.

Adding a solid, professional switch-hitter would open up a lot of options for Clint Hurdle, and give the team another steady bat on which to rely.


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 Post subject: Re: Kendrys Morales
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 5:39 pm 
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J_C_Steel wrote:
StarlingArcher wrote:
I just don't see him making a big difference. Good player, he'd help, wouldn't turn anything around though. He'd be cheap but I don't think he'd solve anything one way or the other besides perception.


You're looking at things wrong. The Pirates aren't going to be able to add Miguel Cabrera, Mike Trout, or Giancarlo Stanton. It's not happening. But Kendrys Morales would make the team better and deeper, and he could be worth anywhere from 1 to 2 extra wins in the second half. Given that the Pirates are in a pennant race, those 1 or 2 extra wins could mean the difference between "word that rhymes with tradeoffs" and going home for the fall.

Adding a solid, professional switch-hitter would open up a lot of options for Clint Hurdle, and give the team another steady bat on which to rely.


He'd make a small difference in the offense but nothing that's going to make the offense live up to the standards set for them.

You're talking about a guy who upgrades 1B by less than Tabata upgraded RF over Snider. If Tabata has made no difference, I don't see what a minor upgrade does to make this an offense that averages 5 runs a game as everyone desires.

If 1 game makes the difference, this team isn't actually a contender. If you think Snider and Jones still have something left that can help you now or in the future, there's no reason to squander that. If one or both is headed to the glue factory careerwise, sure, make the move, but this isn't going to make the offense potent because it's not going to give significantly more production than we're getting.

The 1B platoon is above average in the aggregate. I don't see how going from above average to slightly more above average is a dealbreaker for the season.

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 Post subject: Re: Kendrys Morales
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 5:56 pm 
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StarlingArcher wrote:
If 1 game makes the difference, this team isn't actually a contender.


So if a team wins its division by a single game, that team isn't a contender?

Uh...


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 Post subject: Re: Kendrys Morales
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 6:00 pm 
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Or 2nd Wild Card. If they're a game out of the division, they're in the playoffs with how bad the NL West is.

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 Post subject: Re: Kendrys Morales
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 6:09 pm 
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Adding Morales creates a cascading affect on the offense. He improves 1B, particularly in terms of OBP and consistency, and improves RF by allowing Hurdle to play Tabata or Jones, whoever's hotter. And that, in turn, improves the bench.

Oh, and don't give me this "Tabata can't hit lefties" stuff. You're talking about 2013 only, and it's a small sample size. For his career, Tabata has a higher OPS against LHP.

The Pirates need another "professional hitter." Period. And while that hitter may only marginally improve the offense, in a tight pennant race, that can make a big difference.


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 Post subject: Re: Kendrys Morales
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2013 6:17 pm 
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SSS. Tabata has almost 5x as many AB's against righties and hits them 20 points higher. Slugging is skewed against lefties because of the significantly fewer AB's.

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