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 Post subject: Re: 7-14-2013 - Mets at Pirates
PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 6:54 pm 
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Every manager in the league does this.

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 Post subject: Re: 7-14-2013 - Mets at Pirates
PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 6:56 pm 
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rellimie wrote:
StarlingArcher wrote:
Hurdle seems to like to give some backups time on Sundays. Just his thing I guess. He's done it most years I believe.


When the pirates take the first two on weekend series the backups usually play Sunday.

It has been he practice since he came-- to rest a catcher when a day game follows a night game. While I agree that there have been several days off for the team recently and he could of played, I think it is a strong rule of Hurdle and shows itself on Sundays mostly.

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 Post subject: Re: 7-14-2013 - Mets at Pirates
PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 7:05 pm 
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StarlingArcher wrote:
No. 9 wrote:
StarlingArcher wrote:
Of course Pedro gets rung up on that. BS. Didn't even nick the strike zone.


With the caveat that I have no idea re: the accuracy of the ROOT graphic, it showed the pitch touching the inside of the K zone. My question: why is Pedro taking a close pitch with 2 strikes?


I can't pull up his at-bat on MLB At-Bat app unfortunately. That one showed it as off.

And honestly, I don't believe in swinging at balls, if it was one, in the name of protection. Umps should be capable of calling a defined, black and white zone correctly.

Then again, I'm a staunch proponent of automating the K zone.


If one computer generated K zone showed it as a strike and another one didn't, perhaps that is indicative that even machines are inconsistent on the close ones.

If its close, you've got to be swinging with 2 strikes. Taking a close pitch and hoping that it is a ball (or getting it called a ball) will lead to a lot of long walks to the dugout with the bat still on the player's shoulders. Would rather have a hitter fooled on a tough breaking pitch and strike out swinging than I would watch him take a fastball that was either right on the black or, at worst, just off the black.

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 Post subject: Re: 7-14-2013 - Mets at Pirates
PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 7:12 pm 
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Substitute2 wrote:
rellimie wrote:
StarlingArcher wrote:
Hurdle seems to like to give some backups time on Sundays. Just his thing I guess. He's done it most years I believe.


When the pirates take the first two on weekend series the backups usually play Sunday.

It has been he practice since he came-- to rest a catcher when a day game follows a night game. While I agree that there have been several days off for the team recently and he could of played, I think it is a strong rule of Hurdle and shows itself on Sundays mostly.



Under regular circumstances, I have no problem with the Sunday rest thing. But the All Star Break gives you the opportunity rest Martin and still play him this Sunday.

McKenry hasnt done anything to earn the extra start. He has 3 hits since late MAY.


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 Post subject: Re: 7-14-2013 - Mets at Pirates
PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 7:26 pm 
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MoTownWV wrote:
McKenry hasnt done anything to earn the extra start. He has 3 hits since late MAY.


It's alarming how much the entire bench would be improved simply swapped with internal options. T. Sanchez over McKenry is a no-brainer, it's time, especially with Martin with another year on his contract so Sanchez will be beginning to learn that role. Obviously an Inge DFA would be ideal and theoretically promote DeJesus to take over the Inge/Harrison utility IF role. Doesn't sound like much, but keep in mind for example situations like preferring John McDonald over Jordy Mercer that have happened in the past. I'm all for being patient with Lambo in AAA but eventually that's hopefully a major upgrade over Snider.


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 Post subject: Re: 7-14-2013 - Mets at Pirates
PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 7:37 pm 
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TheShark wrote:
MoTownWV wrote:
McKenry hasnt done anything to earn the extra start. He has 3 hits since late MAY.


It's alarming how much the entire bench would be improved simply swapped with internal options. T. Sanchez over McKenry is a no-brainer, it's time, especially with Martin with another year on his contract so Sanchez will be beginning to learn that role. Obviously an Inge DFA would be ideal and theoretically promote DeJesus to take over the Inge/Harrison utility IF role. Doesn't sound like much, but keep in mind for example situations like preferring John McDonald over Jordy Mercer that have happened in the past. I'm all for being patient with Lambo in AAA but eventually that's hopefully a major upgrade over Snider.



Agreed. Sanchez has played in 2 games and has 2 hits. McKenry has 3 hits in the last 15 games that he has played in.


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 Post subject: Re: 7-14-2013 - Mets at Pirates
PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 7:48 pm 
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The pitch to Pedro was very close..too close to look at and actually a down and in fastball is right in a lefties wheelhouse.... 8-) 8-)


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 Post subject: Re: 7-14-2013 - Mets at Pirates
PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 11:41 pm 
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No. 9 wrote:
Observation #1 - How much fun would it to have been sitting around Cleveland in the top of the first inning if he was "calling them as he seems them?"


Ah can't get me out of your head. Rough start for cole, gave up 3 in the first. Really dissapointed with the bats today, especially against a pitcher like gee. But u can't win them all. Could have gained some ground. I was well behaved, had kids with us.

Had very high seats, but got the all u can eat package which in itself was worth the 42 dollar ticket. Was very hot, and I wore my heavy Stargell jersey. So we did drink a lot of liquids. Place was absolutely packed. Even was on jumbo tron between innings.

Exhausted now, yawn!


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 Post subject: Re: 7-14-2013 - Mets at Pirates
PostPosted: Mon Jul 15, 2013 1:28 pm 
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No. 9 wrote:
Would rather have a hitter fooled on a tough breaking pitch and strike out swinging than I would watch him take a fastball that was either right on the black or, at worst, just off the black.



With Pedro, I don't know if I'd necessarily say that, as he gets a ton of those breaking balls thrown to him.

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 Post subject: Re: 7-14-2013 - Mets at Pirates
PostPosted: Mon Jul 15, 2013 1:29 pm 
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MoTownWV wrote:
McKenry hasnt done anything to earn the extra start. He has 3 hits since late MAY.



Yeah, and the playoffs don't go to the team that wins the most series. You get nothing for winning a series. That third game is as important as any other.

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 Post subject: Re: 7-14-2013 - Mets at Pirates
PostPosted: Mon Jul 15, 2013 2:34 pm 
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No. 9 wrote:
If one computer generated K zone showed it as a strike and another one didn't, perhaps that is indicative that even machines are inconsistent on the close ones.

No, that is indicative of two machines not having the same precoded judgment of what is and is not a strike. Just because ROOT and MLB At Bat both use computerized displays does not mean that they have the same perspective. You might as well say that having human umpires is a mistake based on comparing the opinions of two different people judging a pitch.

You're making the mistake of thinking that having two points of view (i.e., ROOT's strike zone display and MLB At Bat's strike zone display) on a single event is equivalent to one point of view (i.e., an automated strike zone, as judged by a single computer) on two or more separate but similar events. A single machine calling the balls and strikes will be consistent. A human umpire doing so has proven to be very inconsistent.

No. 9 wrote:
If its close, you've got to be swinging with 2 strikes. Taking a close pitch and hoping that it is a ball (or getting it called a ball) will lead to a lot of long walks to the dugout with the bat still on the player's shoulders. Would rather have a hitter fooled on a tough breaking pitch and strike out swinging than I would watch him take a fastball that was either right on the black or, at worst, just off the black.

That type of thinking causes batters to indiscriminately expand the strike zone and get themselves out. You're basically asking batters to swing at anything that looks close, even if it does not end up being close. I don't see how a batter is doing himself many favors by giving into the pitcher.

A pitch is either a strike, or it is not. If a batter does not believe that a pitch will be called a strike, then he should not swing at it. If the batter is wrong, then he needs to re-evaluate his plate judgment, not adopt a new strategy of expanding the strike zone.

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 Post subject: Re: 7-14-2013 - Mets at Pirates
PostPosted: Mon Jul 15, 2013 3:02 pm 
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The called strike 3 to Pedro was inside. Too inside to be a strike, I think, but it was close.

Experience shows that umpires rarely call a strike that is just a tad too far inside. Outside corner, umpires expand the zone a bit, but since they set up on the inside corner, they are "less generous" with called strikes.

That is my long-winded way of explaining why Pedro takes the pitch - it is not a strike, and is rarely called a strike.


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