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 Post subject: Re: Pirates/Braves 5-11-08
PostPosted: Sun May 11, 2008 11:37 pm 
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No. 9 wrote:
tennis08tarheels wrote:
JVB gets a start in the second game. Why?


Duke and Doutramait's similarity?

What an echo!

LOL.

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 Post subject: Re: Pirates/Braves 5-11-08
PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2008 11:01 am 
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No. 9 wrote:
Duke and Doutramait's similarity?

Duke and Doutramait's similarity?

Yes, I was thinking about this last night when I heard that they would double up today. Duke and Dumatrait is an awful lot of relatively soft left-handed tossing to throw at that Brave's lineup on a single day. So I was pleased to hear that JVB was getting a shot in game two. I think it could be a smart move. After his shaky first outing, JVB hasn't looked too bad. I'm interested to see how he's progressed with a year under his belt. Plus, we get his big bat in the lineup to compensate for Bixler. :roll:

BM


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 Post subject: Re: Pirates/Braves 5-11-08
PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2008 12:22 pm 
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I don't consider Doumetreit a soft tosser at 93 on his fastball, but I understand trying to break up the lefties.

ZM

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 Post subject: Re: Pirates/Braves 5-11-08
PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2008 12:30 pm 
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ZelieMike wrote:
I don't consider Doumetreit a soft tosser at 93 on his fastball, but I understand trying to break up the lefties.

ZM



I really don't think its about breaking up the lefties. I think it about not having a day off between now and Duke's next turn in the rotation, meaning if you just went with your rotation, Duke pitches on three days rest this Thursday.


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 Post subject: Re: Pirates/Braves 5-11-08
PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2008 12:46 pm 
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Well yeah, sure BBF. Screw up my posts with intelligent, well thought-out responses!

;)

ZM

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 Post subject: Re: Pirates/Braves 5-11-08
PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2008 12:47 pm 
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ZelieMike wrote:
Well yeah, sure BBF. Screw up my posts with intelligent, well thought-out responses!

;)

ZM


Intelligent posts?

I thought we lost all of the posts from the old board!!!

:lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Pirates/Braves 5-11-08
PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2008 1:02 pm 
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BBF wrote:
I really don't think its about breaking up the lefties. I think it about not having a day off between now and Duke's next turn in the rotation, meaning if you just went with your rotation, Duke pitches on three days rest this Thursday.


BBF-
You lost me here. According to MLB.com, Duke is starting the first game today.

Without the rainout, wouldn't the rotation would have been like this:
Sunday - Duke - ATL
Monday - Doumatriat - ATL
Tuesday - Maholm - STL
Wednesday - Snell - STL
Thursday - Gorzo - STL
Friday - Duke - CHI
Saturday - Doumatrait - CHI
Sunday - Maholm - CHI

I don't see Duke as ever being scheduled for Thursday. He would have been Sunday/Friday.


With the rainout, it appears that the rotation will be:
Monday - Duke/JVB - ATL
Tuesday - Doumatrait - STL
Wednesday - Maholm - STL
Thursday - Snell - STL
Friday - Gorzo - CHI
Saturday - Duke - CHI
Sunday - Doumatrait - CHI

Given the schedule (playing 8 games in the next 7 days), the question is: "when do you start JVB this week?" You could pitch him today and break up the lefty/lefty or you could pitch Duke/Doumatrait today and save JVB for sometime later in the week. It may not have been determinative, but I'm guessing that the lefty/lefty played a factor in the decision making process. I'm also guessing that having JVB pitch at home instead of at STL or CHI also played a factor in the process.

Sounds like a good question for Q&A to Dejan . . . .

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 Post subject: Re: Pirates/Braves 5-11-08
PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2008 1:21 pm 
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How come you can have RH after RH pitcher go consecutively but now all of a sudden people think two lefties in a row is wrong? It is not like they all of a sudden figure out how to hit lefties. Our HS head coach had the same mind set. We had 4 lefties on the staff and he didn't want to use them in the same game nor on consecutive days. WTF?


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 Post subject: Re: Pirates/Braves 5-11-08
PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2008 1:29 pm 
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Az Bucco fan wrote:
How come you can have RH after RH pitcher go consecutively but now all of a sudden people think two lefties in a row is wrong? It is not like they all of a sudden figure out how to hit lefties. Our HS head coach had the same mind set. We had 4 lefties on the staff and he didn't want to use them in the same game nor on consecutive days. WTF?


Two quick thoughts (or at least what I think is the thought process):
1. I wouldn't be a fan of starting two similarly styled pitchers back-to-back in a DH; righties or lefties. I'm a proponent of giving hitters as many varied looks as possible.
2. With lefties, part of their "value" or "effectiveness" is perceived in their rarity. Thus, a lefty with less "stuff" may stick around longer simply because he is unique. The opportunity for hitters to become more comfortable with what they see on the mound would - taking the next logic step - decrease that "uniqueness."

It's not just a lefty/lefty analysis. I'd have no problem with Randy Johnson in his hey day in Game #1 followed by Jamie Moyer in Game #2.
Its about different looks and not letting the hitters get comfortable.

My $.02.

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 Post subject: Re: Pirates/Braves 5-11-08
PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2008 1:34 pm 
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No. 9 wrote:
BBF wrote:
I really don't think its about breaking up the lefties. I think it about not having a day off between now and Duke's next turn in the rotation, meaning if you just went with your rotation, Duke pitches on three days rest this Thursday.


BBF-
You lost me here. According to MLB.com, Duke is starting the first game today.



No 9:

My mistake...he would have been starting on 3 days rest on Friday, not Thursday...so you would want to push him back to Saturday by inserting the extra starter.

So much for that "intelligent post", huh ZM??!!

But you are correct in that it could be argued that VanBenScrotum's turn could have been at any point between now and Friday. Maybe then breaking up the 2 lefties is part of the reason they chose to use him today. Or, maybe given that the forecast today was so bad, they figured they didn't want to expose 2 starters to potential rain delays?

As Az said though, its not as if you can't start 2 righties back to back, so why not start 2 lefties? My guess is that most teams try to split up lefties because they are a precious commodity and they want to "maximize" any perceived value. For the Pirates, we should be looking at splitting up the righties. I had a hockey coach in college who had the same issue with righthanded/lefthanded shots playing on the same line.


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 Post subject: Re: Pirates/Braves 5-11-08
PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2008 2:18 pm 
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BBF wrote:

Or, maybe given that the forecast today was so bad, they figured they didn't want to expose 2 starters to potential rain delays?


Good point. Randy Johnson and Carlos Zambrano sat yesterday for that very reason.

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Obsessive proponent of situational bunting and 2 strike hitting approaches, reflexively pro-catchers calling good games and tasteless proponent of the value of a RBI.


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 Post subject: Re: Pirates/Braves 5-11-08
PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2008 6:33 pm 
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burghermeister wrote:
No. 9 wrote:
Duke and Doutramait's similarity?

Duke and Doutramait's similarity?

Yes, I was thinking about this last night when I heard that they would double up today. Duke and Dumatrait is an awful lot of relatively soft left-handed tossing to throw at that Brave's lineup on a single day. So I was pleased to hear that JVB was getting a shot in game two. I think it could be a smart move. After his shaky first outing, JVB hasn't looked too bad. I'm interested to see how he's progressed with a year under his belt. Plus, we get his big bat in the lineup to compensate for Bixler. :roll:

BM

Dumatrait is no soft tosser. He throws almost as hard as Snell.

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