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 Post subject: March 27 moves
PostPosted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 10:20 am 
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The Pirates have optioned RHP Kyle McPherson, INF Jordy Mercer and OF Alex Presley to AAA Indy.

Pirates also reassigned C Lucas May RHP Vin Mazzaro C Carlos Paulino OF Felix Pie RHP Ryan Reid & LHP Mike Zagurski to minor league camp.

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 Post subject: Re: March 27 moves
PostPosted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 10:37 am 
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From Tim Williams -

The roster as it stands now:

Bench: Michael McKenry, Gaby Sanchez, John McDonald, Jose Tabata, Brandon Inge/Josh Harrison

Bullpen: Jason Grilli, Mark Melancon, Jared Hughes, Tony Watson, Justin Wilson, Chris Leroux, Jeanmar Gomez

Rotation: A.J. Burnett, Wandy Rodriguez, James McDonald, Jonathan Sanchez, Jeff Locke

Catcher – Russell Martin

First Base – Garrett Jones

Second Base – Neil Walker

Shortstop – Clint Barmes

Third Base – Pedro Alvarez

Outfield – Starling Marte, Andrew McCutchen, Travis Snider


So, with Gomez and Leroux making the team, who do you drop from the 40 man for Inge? Clint Robinson? Duke Welker? Also please explain what in the world they see in Gomez that makes him useful in any way, particularly with Bryan Morris at AAA.

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 Post subject: Re: March 27 moves
PostPosted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 11:24 am 
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Barrys Dopers wrote:
From Tim Williams -

The roster as it stands now:

Bench: Michael McKenry, Gaby Sanchez, John McDonald, Jose Tabata, Brandon Inge/Josh Harrison

Bullpen: Jason Grilli, Mark Melancon, Jared Hughes, Tony Watson, Justin Wilson, Chris Leroux, Jeanmar Gomez

Rotation: A.J. Burnett, Wandy Rodriguez, James McDonald, Jonathan Sanchez, Jeff Locke

Catcher – Russell Martin

First Base – Garrett Jones

Second Base – Neil Walker

Shortstop – Clint Barmes

Third Base – Pedro Alvarez

Outfield – Starling Marte, Andrew McCutchen, Travis Snider


So, with Gomez and Leroux making the team, who do you drop from the 40 man for Inge? Clint Robinson? Duke Welker? Also please explain what in the world they see in Gomez that makes him useful in any way, particularly with Bryan Morris at AAA.

I'd say it's baffling, but it is NH and the gang we are dealing with. I'll tell you...looking at this current roster doesn't give me a lot of hope for success this year. The offense better be on FIRE...Cutch, Walker, Alvarez, Marte, Jones in particular. They all have the potential and need to show it right from the start. Also would've like to see Presley as the fourth OF. That pitching staff could be disastrous. Gomez, Leroux, Sanchez...they stink. You send decent prospects like Morris, McPherson, Mercer to AAA...gotta love this management team!


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 Post subject: Re: March 27 moves
PostPosted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 11:35 am 
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That bullpen looks like it is going to be a disaster...hope im wrong.

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 Post subject: Re: March 27 moves
PostPosted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 1:53 pm 
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PirateParrot wrote:
I'd say it's baffling, but it is NH and the gang we are dealing with. I'll tell you...looking at this current roster doesn't give me a lot of hope for success this year. The offense better be on FIRE...Cutch, Walker, Alvarez, Marte, Jones in particular. They all have the potential and need to show it right from the start. Also would've like to see Presley as the fourth OF. That pitching staff could be disastrous. Gomez, Leroux, Sanchez...they stink. You send decent prospects like Morris, McPherson, Mercer to AAA...gotta love this management team!


The only way I see sustainable success in 2013 is if the offense is better than advertised, the top three starters are all excellent, and the bullpen is better than it appears.


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 Post subject: Re: March 27 moves
PostPosted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 6:18 pm 
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And as predicted, keeping Gomez has cost Clint Robinson a roster spot. I hope he clears waivers, I doubt it.

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 Post subject: Re: March 27 moves
PostPosted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 6:40 pm 
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I guess they might think they got their Robinson replacement in Sands. I definitely hope he clears waivers but would also doubt it.


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 Post subject: Re: March 27 moves
PostPosted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 6:50 pm 
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PirateParrot wrote:
Barrys Dopers wrote:
From Tim Williams -

The roster as it stands now:

Bench: Michael McKenry, Gaby Sanchez, John McDonald, Jose Tabata, Brandon Inge/Josh Harrison

Bullpen: Jason Grilli, Mark Melancon, Jared Hughes, Tony Watson, Justin Wilson, Chris Leroux, Jeanmar Gomez

Rotation: A.J. Burnett, Wandy Rodriguez, James McDonald, Jonathan Sanchez, Jeff Locke

Catcher – Russell Martin

First Base – Garrett Jones

Second Base – Neil Walker

Shortstop – Clint Barmes

Third Base – Pedro Alvarez

Outfield – Starling Marte, Andrew McCutchen, Travis Snider


So, with Gomez and Leroux making the team, who do you drop from the 40 man for Inge? Clint Robinson? Duke Welker? Also please explain what in the world they see in Gomez that makes him useful in any way, particularly with Bryan Morris at AAA.

I'd say it's baffling, but it is NH and the gang we are dealing with. I'll tell you...looking at this current roster doesn't give me a lot of hope for success this year. The offense better be on FIRE...Cutch, Walker, Alvarez, Marte, Jones in particular. They all have the potential and need to show it right from the start. Also would've like to see Presley as the fourth OF. That pitching staff could be disastrous. Gomez, Leroux, Sanchez...they stink. You send decent prospects like Morris, McPherson, Mercer to AAA...gotta love this management team!


Presley as 4th OF? Over Tabata?

Every year though for the past few, it seems like our pen is made up of a bunch of nobodies, cast-offs, and rejects, and they have been pretty good. Let's hope for the best and wait and see.

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 Post subject: Re: March 27 moves
PostPosted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 6:52 pm 
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I don't know what they see in Gomez. Certainly nothing in his stat sheet suggests he is a good pitcher.

But I'm not too concerned if we lose Robinson. I don't think he has quite what it takes to be a regular, and he's not that useful as a bench player.


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 Post subject: Re: March 27 moves
PostPosted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 7:11 pm 
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That bullpen and the bench players suck and thats all I am going to say about that, but I hope they prove me wrong.


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 Post subject: Re: March 27 moves
PostPosted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 11:14 pm 
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Having just read this thread, it appears that the glass looks 1/4th full to most of you. Come on with that spring time hope. Our depth is much better in position players and we have decent starters with 3 more good pitchers coming in late spring. We are still weak at ss and relievers look suspect but hell, who knows-- maybe we'll all perform above expectations. They have possibilities.

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 Post subject: Re: March 27 moves
PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:47 am 
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Substitute2 wrote:
Having just read this thread, it appears that the glass looks 1/4th full to most of you. Come on with that spring time hope. Our depth is much better in position players and we have decent starters with 3 more good pitchers coming in late spring. We are still weak at ss and relievers look suspect but hell, who knows-- maybe we'll all perform above expectations. They have possibilities.


Yeah Sub, its kind of funny, in years past we have seen lots of optimism, despite huge roster problems. Now that we actually have a competitive roster on paper people are more negative. Its got to be the residual anger over the collapse. I'm still pretty numb to what happened, its almost surreal.

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 Post subject: Re: March 27 moves
PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 11:35 am 
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Barrys Dopers wrote:
Substitute2 wrote:
Having just read this thread, it appears that the glass looks 1/4th full to most of you. Come on with that spring time hope. Our depth is much better in position players and we have decent starters with 3 more good pitchers coming in late spring. We are still weak at ss and relievers look suspect but hell, who knows-- maybe we'll all perform above expectations. They have possibilities.


Yeah Sub, its kind of funny, in years past we have seen lots of optimism, despite huge roster problems. Now that we actually have a competitive roster on paper people are more negative. Its got to be the residual anger over the collapse. I'm still pretty numb to what happened, its almost surreal.

The problem I have, which is making me more pessimistic this season, is you want to see improvement. I don't. Here and there, yes...but overall I don't. They've teased us each of the past two seasons and as a fan you want to see them take that next step, sort of like when they showed glimpses in the late 80's and then made the jump in '90. I don't see that. We constantly have to go to the scrap heap because we either don't have or don't trust our own young players.

Look, nobody really knows what will happen until they take the field and start playing. On paper the offense should be better because you would hope guys like Alvarez, Marte, and maybe even Walker and Cutch take steps forward. Martin MAY help and you hope Jones/Sancez, Snider/Tabata can contribute the same or more than they did last year. But the pitching worries me A LOT. I'm worried that it could turn disastrous. With poor pitching most teams are in big trouble...and that is why I'm more pessimistic this year. Not only do I not see improvement with the staff, they may have taken a step back.


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 Post subject: Re: March 27 moves
PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 1:40 pm 
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PirateParrot wrote:
Barrys Dopers wrote:
Substitute2 wrote:
Having just read this thread, it appears that the glass looks 1/4th full to most of you. Come on with that spring time hope. Our depth is much better in position players and we have decent starters with 3 more good pitchers coming in late spring. We are still weak at ss and relievers look suspect but hell, who knows-- maybe we'll all perform above expectations. They have possibilities.


Yeah Sub, its kind of funny, in years past we have seen lots of optimism, despite huge roster problems. Now that we actually have a competitive roster on paper people are more negative. Its got to be the residual anger over the collapse. I'm still pretty numb to what happened, its almost surreal.

The problem I have, which is making me more pessimistic this season, is you want to see improvement. I don't. Here and there, yes...but overall I don't. They've teased us each of the past two seasons and as a fan you want to see them take that next step, sort of like when they showed glimpses in the late 80's and then made the jump in '90. I don't see that. We constantly have to go to the scrap heap because we either don't have or don't trust our own young players.

Look, nobody really knows what will happen until they take the field and start playing. On paper the offense should be better because you would hope guys like Alvarez, Marte, and maybe even Walker and Cutch take steps forward. Martin MAY help and you hope Jones/Sancez, Snider/Tabata can contribute the same or more than they did last year. But the pitching worries me A LOT. I'm worried that it could turn disastrous. With poor pitching most teams are in big trouble...and that is why I'm more pessimistic this year. Not only do I not see improvement with the staff, they may have taken a step back.


There is no logical way to say that this year's staff looks worse than last year's opening day staff. AJ was coming off a terrible 2011 and hurt, Bedard was a wild card at best, JMac and Morton (hurt) were question marks, Karstens and Correia rounded out the group, with Lincoln and Owens at AAA.

This year you have two solid locked in guys at the front, JMac is still JMac, and Locke, Karstens, Liriano, KMac, Cole.

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 Post subject: Re: March 27 moves
PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 1:55 pm 
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I hear you, BD, but Burnett and Rodriguez are each a year older and Jonathan Sanchez and Jeff Locke as the Nos. 4 and 5 starters to begin the year makes more Pirate fans very nervous.

I'll feel a bit better when Liriano, Cole, Morton, and Karstens are available as options, but until then, the rotation is fragile and wafer thin.


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 Post subject: Re: March 27 moves
PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 4:18 pm 
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J_C_Steel wrote:
I hear you, BD, but Burnett and Rodriguez are each a year older and Jonathan Sanchez and Jeff Locke as the Nos. 4 and 5 starters to begin the year makes more Pirate fans very nervous.

I'll feel a bit better when Liriano, Cole, Morton, and Karstens are available as options, but until then, the rotation is fragile and wafer thin.

Exactly. With those guys healthy I will like it a whole lot better.


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 Post subject: Re: March 27 moves
PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 4:20 pm 
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J_C_Steel wrote:
I hear you, BD, but Burnett and Rodriguez are each a year older and Jonathan Sanchez and Jeff Locke as the Nos. 4 and 5 starters to begin the year makes more Pirate fans very nervous.

I'll feel a bit better when Liriano, Cole, Morton, and Karstens are available as options, but until then, the rotation is fragile and wafer thin.


You can't have it both ways though, if you want them to play the kids, then don't be upset that they are unproven.

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 Post subject: Re: March 27 moves
PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 5:20 pm 
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Barrys Dopers wrote:
You can't have it both ways though, if you want them to play the kids, then don't be upset that they are unproven.


I don't mind "guys who are unproven." That's fine. I mind "guys who suck at baseball." Let's hope Sanchez and Locke fall into the former category and not the latter category.

Oh, and I want them to play "kids" with significant talent and upside. Like Gerrit Cole. Like Matt Adams in St. Louis.


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 Post subject: Re: March 27 moves
PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 5:39 pm 
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J_C_Steel wrote:
Barrys Dopers wrote:
You can't have it both ways though, if you want them to play the kids, then don't be upset that they are unproven.


I don't mind "guys who are unproven." That's fine. I mind "guys who suck at baseball." Let's hope Sanchez and Locke fall into the former category and not the latter category.

Oh, and I want them to play "kids" with significant talent and upside. Like Gerrit Cole. Like Matt Adams in St. Louis.


Jeff Locke has similar upside as Matt Adams. Baseball America ranked them both as 50 grade prospects. A #4 MLB SP is certainly as valuable as a high K, low BB, power 1B bat.

I have about zero faith in Jonathan Sanchez, that should be KMac's spot in my opinion. At this point I'm just hoping we get lucky for once with a scrap heap arm.

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 Post subject: Re: March 27 moves
PostPosted: Fri Mar 29, 2013 4:48 pm 
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Barrys Dopers wrote:
And as predicted, keeping Gomez has cost Clint Robinson a roster spot. I hope he clears waivers, I doubt it.


Robinson was claimed by the Blue Jays today. His best shot will come with an AL team anyway.

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