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 Post subject: Garrett Jones
PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2012 9:50 pm 
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So, Garrett Jones is a below average fielder, 31 years old, lifetime hitter of about 250/320/460/780 averages about 20 home runs per year. For the most part he is a platoon player but is having a career year at the age of 31 of 275/320/512/832

Before I say this I just want to say I love Garrett Jones.

BUT

Would you trade him this off season and get max value?


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 Post subject: Re: Garrett Jones
PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2012 10:27 pm 
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For a quality arm or SS/C, yes.

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 Post subject: Re: Garrett Jones
PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2012 11:52 pm 
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I would guess that both he, and Hanrahan get traded so they won't have to pay their arbitration prices which should both rise. Gaby will start at 1b. We will probably be complaining come June that Gaby sucks cause we are Pirate fans and that is part of the yearly hell we have to endure.


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 Post subject: Re: Garrett Jones
PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2012 11:53 pm 
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This would be the time that you would get the absolute most value for him. Based on age alone, you can't expect any growth than the numbers he had this year. I think that Sanchez is capable of manning 1b full time next year. With an OF mix of McCutchen and a combo of Snider, Marte and Tabata, it wouldn't be devasting to trade him.

The Blue Jays have two legit C's in Arenciba and D'arnaud (Chase's younger but more talented brother). They would probably prefer pitching but don't really have a firstbaseman.


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 Post subject: Re: Garrett Jones
PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 12:47 am 
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rellimie wrote:
So, Garrett Jones is a below average fielder, 31 years old, lifetime hitter of about 250/320/460/780 averages about 20 home runs per year. For the most part he is a platoon player but is having a career year at the age of 31 of 275/320/512/832

Before I say this I just want to say I love Garrett Jones.

BUT

Would you trade him this off season and get max value?

I'd listen to offers and trade him if I got a good one, but I'd have no problem with going to arbitration if I didn't.

Hanrahan is the one who I really hope they trade.

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 Post subject: Re: Garrett Jones
PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 10:17 am 
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sisyphus wrote:
rellimie wrote:
So, Garrett Jones is a below average fielder, 31 years old, lifetime hitter of about 250/320/460/780 averages about 20 home runs per year. For the most part he is a platoon player but is having a career year at the age of 31 of 275/320/512/832

Before I say this I just want to say I love Garrett Jones.

BUT

Would you trade him this off season and get max value?

I'd listen to offers and trade him if I got a good one, but I'd have no problem with going to arbitration if I didn't.

Hanrahan is the one who I really hope they trade.


Gotta deal Hammer, he's in his last year in 2013 and will command about $7 million. I also would look to move Garrett at peak value, Gaby can give us similar production and we have 5 OF's for 3 spots.

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 Post subject: Re: Garrett Jones
PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 11:32 am 
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Barrys Dopers wrote:
sisyphus wrote:
rellimie wrote:
So, Garrett Jones is a below average fielder, 31 years old, lifetime hitter of about 250/320/460/780 averages about 20 home runs per year. For the most part he is a platoon player but is having a career year at the age of 31 of 275/320/512/832

Before I say this I just want to say I love Garrett Jones.

BUT

Would you trade him this off season and get max value?

I'd listen to offers and trade him if I got a good one, but I'd have no problem with going to arbitration if I didn't.

Hanrahan is the one who I really hope they trade.


Gotta deal Hammer, he's in his last year in 2013 and will command about $7 million. I also would look to move Garrett at peak value, Gaby can give us similar production and we have 5 OF's for 3 spots.

Gaby can't hit right handers. You have to have a platoon partner for him, and Jones fits the profile well. I'd only deal him if somebody wants to overpay.

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 Post subject: Re: Garrett Jones
PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 11:37 am 
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sisyphus wrote:
Barrys Dopers wrote:
sisyphus wrote:
I'd listen to offers and trade him if I got a good one, but I'd have no problem with going to arbitration if I didn't.

Hanrahan is the one who I really hope they trade.


Gotta deal Hammer, he's in his last year in 2013 and will command about $7 million. I also would look to move Garrett at peak value, Gaby can give us similar production and we have 5 OF's for 3 spots.

Gaby can't hit right handers. You have to have a platoon partner for him, and Jones fits the profile well. I'd only deal him if somebody wants to overpay.



.713 ops vs RH isn't exactly "can't hit" territory. You could platoon Snider at 1B some (if Tabata hits) or use Matt Curry who will be at AAA to start the year. Or you could trade Jones for a corner bat.

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 Post subject: Re: Garrett Jones
PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 12:17 pm 
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I know they're totally replaceable and all and not worth top dollar, but...

If the Bus trade Hammer, who takes over as closer?

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 Post subject: Re: Garrett Jones
PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 12:32 pm 
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I agree NS...the bullpen proved to be paper thin by year's end. I'm not against trading Hanrahan, because he is erratic and in the last year of his contract. But they have nobody for that role. Grilli has really showed his age the second half. He hasn't been awful but his velocity on most nights the second half have made him very hittable. Remember, in theory the Pirates should be looking at contending next year so you can trade these guys off, but you better have quality replacements for them.

Trading Jones sounds great, but who is giving up very much for a 31 year old, average defensive guy who could just as easily hit .240 next year with 17 HR's as .280 with 30 HR's? And again who replaces him? Gaby Sanchez? Maybe if you could be assured he finds himself again. Yea, he has looked marginally better as a Pirate...but I'm not sure I want to rely on him just yet.

I would love to see them get Jon Lester. He is a year removed from being dominant. He is a classic change of scenery guy.


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 Post subject: Re: Garrett Jones
PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 7:25 pm 
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Barrys Dopers wrote:
sisyphus wrote:
rellimie wrote:
So, Garrett Jones is a below average fielder, 31 years old, lifetime hitter of about 250/320/460/780 averages about 20 home runs per year. For the most part he is a platoon player but is having a career year at the age of 31 of 275/320/512/832

Before I say this I just want to say I love Garrett Jones.

BUT

Would you trade him this off season and get max value?

I'd listen to offers and trade him if I got a good one, but I'd have no problem with going to arbitration if I didn't.

Hanrahan is the one who I really hope they trade.


Gotta deal Hammer, he's in his last year in 2013 and will command about $7 million. I also would look to move Garrett at peak value, Gaby can give us similar production and we have 5 OF's for 3 spots.


I don't think Sanchez could hit .280 with 25+ homers. I would however trade Jones if we could package him up with Hanrahan for a SS or C.


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 Post subject: Re: Garrett Jones
PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 8:46 pm 
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PirateParrot wrote:
I agree NS...the bullpen proved to be paper thin by year's end. I'm not against trading Hanrahan, because he is erratic and in the last year of his contract. But they have nobody for that role. Grilli has really showed his age the second half. He hasn't been awful but his velocity on most nights the second half have made him very hittable. Remember, in theory the Pirates should be looking at contending next year so you can trade these guys off, but you better have quality replacements for them.


Exactly. There is no young Evan Meek waiting in the wings.

Best case replacement scenario is Bryan Morris, but has he even thrown innings in the Bigs this year???

Couldn't agree more about Lester.

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 Post subject: Re: Garrett Jones
PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 11:13 pm 
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Barrys Dopers wrote:
.713 ops vs RH isn't exactly "can't hit" territory. You could platoon Snider at 1B some (if Tabata hits) or use Matt Curry who will be at AAA to start the year. Or you could trade Jones for a corner bat.

.596 OPS vs RH this season is deep into "can't hit" territory, and getting a .713 OPS from your first baseman is absolutely horrific.

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 Post subject: Re: Garrett Jones
PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 11:21 pm 
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NSMaster56 wrote:
I know they're totally replaceable and all and not worth top dollar, but...

If the Bus trade Hammer, who takes over as closer?

Anybody. Who was Hanrahan before they went and got him? A hard throwing stiff who had already blown two shots at being a closer and was carrying a lifetime ERA of 4.77. They've got much tougher holes to fill than closer before they need to start worrying about who's going to throw 60 innings next year.

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 Post subject: Re: Garrett Jones
PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 11:26 pm 
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NSMaster56 wrote:
PirateParrot wrote:
I agree NS...the bullpen proved to be paper thin by year's end. I'm not against trading Hanrahan, because he is erratic and in the last year of his contract. But they have nobody for that role. Grilli has really showed his age the second half. He hasn't been awful but his velocity on most nights the second half have made him very hittable. Remember, in theory the Pirates should be looking at contending next year so you can trade these guys off, but you better have quality replacements for them.


Exactly. There is no young Evan Meek waiting in the wings.

Best case replacement scenario is Bryan Morris, but has he even thrown innings in the Bigs this year???

Couldn't agree more about Lester.

Saw him in the game a couple of nights ago ripping off a slider with good movement at 90 mph. I think that Hughes could also handle the job. Or Justin Wilson. Possibly Leroux as well.

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 Post subject: Re: Garrett Jones
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 12:12 am 
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sisyphus wrote:
Or Justin Wilson.


Isn't it fairly unconventional to have a L closer?

Plus, hasn't JW thrown like 0 pitches in the Bigs so far during this meltdown?

You'd think that they'd be 'grooming' a closer now if Hammer were to be moved...

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 Post subject: Re: Garrett Jones
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 12:57 am 
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sisyphus wrote:
NSMaster56 wrote:
PirateParrot wrote:
I agree NS...the bullpen proved to be paper thin by year's end. I'm not against trading Hanrahan, because he is erratic and in the last year of his contract. But they have nobody for that role. Grilli has really showed his age the second half. He hasn't been awful but his velocity on most nights the second half have made him very hittable. Remember, in theory the Pirates should be looking at contending next year so you can trade these guys off, but you better have quality replacements for them.


Exactly. There is no young Evan Meek waiting in the wings.

Best case replacement scenario is Bryan Morris, but has he even thrown innings in the Bigs this year???

Couldn't agree more about Lester.

Saw him in the game a couple of nights ago ripping off a slider with good movement at 90 mph. I think that Hughes could also handle the job. Or Justin Wilson. Possibly Leroux as well.

Hughes, Wilson, Leroux....no way. Not saying trading Hanrahan is a bad idea. However if they view themselves as contenders, and I would hope they do, having a competent closer is important. Also not sure you get decent value in return for him. Not hard for others to see his erratic pitching.


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 Post subject: Re: Garrett Jones
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 8:16 am 
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NSMaster56 wrote:
sisyphus wrote:
Or Justin Wilson.


Isn't it fairly unconventional to have a L closer?

Plus, hasn't JW thrown like 0 pitches in the Bigs so far during this meltdown?

You'd think that they'd be 'grooming' a closer now if Hammer were to be moved...


I don't think that they think that far ahead. Tony Sanchez saw zero pitches this fall and it's obvious Barajas is done.


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 Post subject: Re: Garrett Jones
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 10:17 am 
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Closers are a dime a dozen.

I would deal the Hammer in a heart beat if someone would give an every day starter for him.


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 Post subject: Re: Garrett Jones
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 11:13 am 
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fuzzy159 wrote:
Closers are a dime a dozen.

I would deal the Hammer in a heart beat if someone would give an every day starter for him.

But bullpens are not. We let Lincoln go, and despite Grilli's 13 pitch, 3 strikeout inning last night, he's not pitched as well the past two months, either. I'd hate to see him go for a Wandy-type starter. A true #2, maybe.


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