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 Post subject: Real Pirates Don't Abandon Ship...
PostPosted: Fri Sep 21, 2012 11:10 am 
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Scalawags,

I'm as frustrated as anyone about the Pirates' second straight season-ending collapse. And I firmly believe that 2012 ranks as the most disappointing season of the last 20, precisely because of the hope engendered by this crew over the first four months of the campaign. And I also believe that honest and, particularly at this point, even scathing critiques of Pirates' players, coaches, managers and owners are part and parcel with being a die-hard fan.

But none of that should mean that members abandon this Board -- a right honorable Pirate ship proudly bearing The Colors.

In the end, we all enjoy the game of baseball. We may disagree about the Pirates, but we all follow them for one reason or another -- family, roots, habit, or even a slightly masochistic outlook. Let's stick together.

Your Faithful Bo'sun,

J_C_Steel


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 Post subject: Re: Real Pirates Don't Abandon Ship...
PostPosted: Fri Sep 21, 2012 11:13 am 
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I'm in.

I've been a fan since the late 70's and I've suffered through far worse seasons than this one.


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 Post subject: Re: Real Pirates Don't Abandon Ship...
PostPosted: Fri Sep 21, 2012 12:09 pm 
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You know I'm in.

With any degree of objectivity there have been tremendous positives this year. Ask a non-Pittsburgh writer about the team and you will hear about McCutchen's rise to prominance, Alvarez's career saving year, JMac's falsh of brilliance, and a system with many impact prospects.

Last year 72 wins was rather fluky, my goal for 2012 was to win mid to high 70's and make it be sustainable. They are on track to do even better than my expectations.

Obviously disappointment is higher this year than any other, but the team is on track and closer to success than ever before in the last 20 years. Now is not the time to abandon ship.

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 Post subject: Re: Real Pirates Don't Abandon Ship...
PostPosted: Fri Sep 21, 2012 12:18 pm 
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yea, they had some good signs this year and i think they will be better next year, they just need to play consistent for 162, not 122....they fell apart last year in late july, this year they fell apart in mid august, next year if they fall apart in september they will still be in it until the end...2014 is the year to watch out for...

Pedro needs to get even better and that is mainly through consistency, macdonald needs to go on a vacation far far far away and FOCUS when he gets back, snider needs to vacation to toronto so he can find that power that he left there. hurdle needs to get breath mints so he does not chew his face off


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 Post subject: Re: Real Pirates Don't Abandon Ship...
PostPosted: Fri Sep 21, 2012 12:28 pm 
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I've posted less this season, but that's due to a lack of time relative to opening my own business rather than anything else. I simply haven't been following baseball as closely.

That said, I had the Pirates pegged as a 78-80 win team at the beginning of the season and that seems to be where they're headed, albeit by an odd, soul-crushing route. I do think it's (past) time for change at the top.

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 Post subject: Re: Real Pirates Don't Abandon Ship...
PostPosted: Fri Sep 21, 2012 8:59 pm 
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Word.

Image

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 Post subject: Re: Real Pirates Don't Abandon Ship...
PostPosted: Sat Sep 22, 2012 10:59 am 
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Meh. There's always next year. Just a game.

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 Post subject: Re: Real Pirates Don't Abandon Ship...
PostPosted: Sat Sep 22, 2012 11:35 am 
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I get absolutely zero pleasure in asking this question: have the Pirates' players abandoned ship?

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Reflexively, obsessively and tastelessly submitted,
No. 9
Obsessive proponent of situational bunting and 2 strike hitting approaches, reflexively pro-catchers calling good games and tasteless proponent of the value of a RBI.


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 Post subject: Re: Real Pirates Don't Abandon Ship...
PostPosted: Sat Sep 22, 2012 1:34 pm 
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No. 9 wrote:
I get absolutely zero pleasure in asking this question: have the Pirates' players abandoned ship?


I'm not sure they've quit, I won't go there. I will say they seem like a team that lacks balls. They've missed opportunities to show strength. One example is how they let the Chapman/McCutchen incident go. All I heard were excuses from the Pirates as to why they never retaliated. I believe Hurdle said something along the lines of "We won't forget this". Too late Coach. Show toughness, show heart the next day, the next pitch. Be aggressive, not reactionary. As it turns out, they cowered in the corner and took a beating and the season has become an epic disaster.

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 Post subject: Re: Real Pirates Don't Abandon Ship...
PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2012 12:29 pm 
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Don't say one thing then do another. How about next year keep your mouth shut. Manage this team for a full season.


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 Post subject: Re: Real Pirates Don't Abandon Ship...
PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2012 1:18 pm 
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IA Pirate wrote:
One example is how they let the Chapman/McCutchen incident go. All I heard were excuses from the Pirates as to why they never retaliated. I believe Hurdle said something along the lines of "We won't forget this". Too late Coach. Show toughness, show heart the next day, the next pitch. Be aggressive, not reactionary.

What would a Hell's Angel have done? /ducks


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 Post subject: Re: Real Pirates Don't Abandon Ship...
PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 3:22 am 
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I'm in.

I don't post very often on here - mostly because I'm watching from afar; I haven't been a Pirates fan for much longer than 2 seasons, and as a result, most of the in depth discussions involve me learning about the team/organization rather than having any worthy input.

But I chose the Buccos, for whatever reason, and that won't be changing irrespective of what happens on the field.

I got on the bus today in Vancouver, and the bus driver said "What's happening to our Pirates?" - We sat and chatted for my journey, and we concluded that its still a work in progress. We also concluded that at least we don't follow the Wankees.

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 Post subject: Re: Real Pirates Don't Abandon Ship...
PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 8:42 am 
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IA Pirate wrote:
No. 9 wrote:
I get absolutely zero pleasure in asking this question: have the Pirates' players abandoned ship?


I'm not sure they've quit, I won't go there. I will say they seem like a team that lacks balls. They've missed opportunities to show strength. One example is how they let the Chapman/McCutchen incident go. All I heard were excuses from the Pirates as to why they never retaliated. I believe Hurdle said something along the lines of "We won't forget this". Too late Coach. Show toughness, show heart the next day, the next pitch. Be aggressive, not reactionary. As it turns out, they cowered in the corner and took a beating and the season has become an epic disaster.


Excellent post.

It's interesting that last season's turning point was the 19 inning Meals fiasco. The Chapman incident was the beginning of the end this season.


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 Post subject: Re: Real Pirates Don't Abandon Ship...
PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 9:45 am 
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Re: toughness and the Chapman incident.

I vaguely remember a Stanley Cup run where the Penguins were getting gooned over pretty good. Everyone in Pittsburgh was clamoring for the Pens to retaliate, that they were soft, and that Larry Murphy should be traded/benched immediately because he was the biggest wuss ever to lace 'em up. Well they went on to outscore everyone and win the cup while continuing to avoid the goonery, and then everyone was all in love with how the Penguins didn't stoop to the level of their opponents -- they just went out and took care of business where it counted -- on the scoreboard.


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 Post subject: Re: Real Pirates Don't Abandon Ship...
PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:05 am 
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VanSlick wrote:
IA Pirate wrote:
No. 9 wrote:
I get absolutely zero pleasure in asking this question: have the Pirates' players abandoned ship?


I'm not sure they've quit, I won't go there. I will say they seem like a team that lacks balls. They've missed opportunities to show strength. One example is how they let the Chapman/McCutchen incident go. All I heard were excuses from the Pirates as to why they never retaliated. I believe Hurdle said something along the lines of "We won't forget this". Too late Coach. Show toughness, show heart the next day, the next pitch. Be aggressive, not reactionary. As it turns out, they cowered in the corner and took a beating and the season has become an epic disaster.


Excellent post.

It's interesting that last season's turning point was the 19 inning Meals fiasco. The Chapman incident was the beginning of the end this season.


I don't know they were 7-9 after that up through the 19 inning game in STL. The collapse started the next day in SD. The are 8-24 since then, yep .250 baseball. I am in no way trying to pin the collapse on one game, but I'd say it started after the 19 inning game just like last year.

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 Post subject: Re: Real Pirates Don't Abandon Ship...
PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 12:50 pm 
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Barrys Dopers wrote:
I don't know they were 7-9 after that up through the 19 inning game in STL. The collapse started the next day in SD. The are 8-24 since then, yep .250 baseball. I am in no way trying to pin the collapse on one game, but I'd say it started after the 19 inning game just like last year.

The collapse started immediately after the all star break. They never played good baseball, save for a couple games here and there, after the break. They only hung in there because of the level of opponents after the break. But it wasn't good baseball.


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 Post subject: Re: Real Pirates Don't Abandon Ship...
PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 12:55 pm 
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PirateParrot wrote:
Barrys Dopers wrote:
I don't know they were 7-9 after that up through the 19 inning game in STL. The collapse started the next day in SD. The are 8-24 since then, yep .250 baseball. I am in no way trying to pin the collapse on one game, but I'd say it started after the 19 inning game just like last year.

The collapse started immediately after the all star break. They never played good baseball, save for a couple games here and there, after the break. They only hung in there because of the level of opponents after the break. But it wasn't good baseball.


But now they are losing to those bad teams, then they were beating them. They started 12-7 after the break, you don't do that on luck alone.

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 Post subject: Re: Real Pirates Don't Abandon Ship...
PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 1:56 pm 
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zogby wrote:
Re: toughness and the Chapman incident.

I vaguely remember a Stanley Cup run where the Penguins were getting gooned over pretty good. Everyone in Pittsburgh was clamoring for the Pens to retaliate, that they were soft, and that Larry Murphy should be traded/benched immediately because he was the biggest wuss ever to lace 'em up. Well they went on to outscore everyone and win the cup while continuing to avoid the goonery, and then everyone was all in love with how the Penguins didn't stoop to the level of their opponents -- they just went out and took care of business where it counted -- on the scoreboard.



And then this year, the reverse happened in the Philly series, and everybody was disgusted with them.

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 Post subject: Re: Real Pirates Don't Abandon Ship...
PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 3:36 pm 
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Barrys Dopers wrote:
PirateParrot wrote:
Barrys Dopers wrote:
I don't know they were 7-9 after that up through the 19 inning game in STL. The collapse started the next day in SD. The are 8-24 since then, yep .250 baseball. I am in no way trying to pin the collapse on one game, but I'd say it started after the 19 inning game just like last year.

The collapse started immediately after the all star break. They never played good baseball, save for a couple games here and there, after the break. They only hung in there because of the level of opponents after the break. But it wasn't good baseball.


But now they are losing to those bad teams, then they were beating them. They started 12-7 after the break, you don't do that on luck alone.

No, you're right in the truest sense of the word collapse. I was referring to when they started playing bad baseball. It wasn't luck that won those games, it was the other teams being really bad. And again you are right...since then they have taken it to a whole new level, capping it by losing 2/3 to the Astros. But anyone watching them since the all star break should've seen this coming...or if you are like me you saw it but kept hoping they would be able to stop and reverse course. Didn't happen.


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