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 Post subject: Re: Hurdle is a genius....
PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2012 9:21 pm 
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No flaming away...but I would disagree. His inexplicable devotion to certain players despite their obvious failure to produce (in both standard and sabremetric indicators) is mind boggling. While there could be some argument about sticking with Clint Barmes because of his glove and the lack of depth at SS, there is NO valid argument to continue jogging Rod Barajas out there 4-5 times a week.


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 Post subject: Re: Hurdle is a genius....
PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2012 9:25 pm 
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Location: West Virginia
Chris Anderson wrote:
No flaming away...but I would disagree. His inexplicable devotion to certain players despite their obvious failure to produce (in both standard and sabremetric indicators) is mind boggling. While there could be some argument about sticking with Clint Barmes because of his glove and the lack of depth at SS, there is NO valid argument to continue jogging Rod Barajas out there 4-5 times a week.


We have ZERO good Major League catchers on this team right now. That's right , Michael McKenry sucks too...


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 Post subject: Re: Hurdle is a genius....
PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2012 9:26 pm 
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Also, I joked earlier in this thread about Bobby Valentine. Can you think of another manager that is more overrated than Bobby V in recent memory? There was such a big deal about him coming to Boston, like a savior. He hasn't won shit in his career! Texas was never better than mediocre while he was their manager. The Mets, despite a huge payroll and several big name players, NEVER won their division. Yes, they made it to the W.S. is 2000, but as a Wild Card team. Overall in his career, he is barely better than a break-even manager with his teams finishing an average of 3.8th in their division.

Combine the mediocre record with his "hijinks" and I think he just basically blows.


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 Post subject: Re: Hurdle is a genius....
PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2012 9:47 pm 
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CashInFist wrote:
Chris Anderson wrote:
No flaming away...but I would disagree. His inexplicable devotion to certain players despite their obvious failure to produce (in both standard and sabremetric indicators) is mind boggling. While there could be some argument about sticking with Clint Barmes because of his glove and the lack of depth at SS, there is NO valid argument to continue jogging Rod Barajas out there 4-5 times a week.


We have ZERO good Major League catchers on this team right now. That's right , Michael McKenry sucks too...



Overall McKenry has over an .800 OPS (11th amongst catchers with as many PA's). His WAR is 1.4 (16th in MLB for catchers). While he may not be a superstar, he does not suck. The one area that he seems to suffer in is his catcher's ERA (4.23), however one could say that he doesn't necessarily get a fair shake there, because the team's BEST pitcher uses Barajas as his personal caddie, as did McDonald for a majority of the year. That left the Fort catching Bedard, Correia, et al, not exactly helpful to him there.


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 Post subject: Re: Hurdle is a genius....
PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2012 10:20 pm 
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Chris Anderson wrote:
CashInFist wrote:
Chris Anderson wrote:
No flaming away...but I would disagree. His inexplicable devotion to certain players despite their obvious failure to produce (in both standard and sabremetric indicators) is mind boggling. While there could be some argument about sticking with Clint Barmes because of his glove and the lack of depth at SS, there is NO valid argument to continue jogging Rod Barajas out there 4-5 times a week.


We have ZERO good Major League catchers on this team right now. That's right , Michael McKenry sucks too...



Overall McKenry has over an .800 OPS (11th amongst catchers with as many PA's). His WAR is 1.4 (16th in MLB for catchers). While he may not be a superstar, he does not suck. The one area that he seems to suffer in is his catcher's ERA (4.23), however one could say that he doesn't necessarily get a fair shake there, because the team's BEST pitcher uses Barajas as his personal caddie, as did McDonald for a majority of the year. That left the Fort catching Bedard, Correia, et al, not exactly helpful to him there.


McKenry can NOT throw out a baserunner! Par for our course.


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 Post subject: Re: Hurdle is a genius....
PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2012 10:42 pm 
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McKenry's CS% is pathetic...but it's still nearly twice Barajas. Interestingly, his minor league numbers indicate he is better at throwing runners out than he has this year (career 36% throwing out runners...which isn't bad).

With both Barajas and McKenry sucking so bad (and much worse than their career averages) it makes me wonder how much of the onus should be placed on the pitching staff not holding the runners well?


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 Post subject: Re: Hurdle is a genius....
PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2012 10:54 pm 
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Whether or not Hurdle is a good manager, he's put himself in a win or bust situation.

By leading this squad to back-to-back breakout starts, it's clear he has the ability to get this talented team on the right track and deliver on their promise.

The second half swoons show that he either may not be the man to take this team all the way, or perhaps cannot focus them for a full 162+.

In any event, the success of this team in such a short time is due in some part to him and now it's pretty much 'playoffs or off with his head' come next year, as the bar has clearly been raised (as was expected and should have been).

If the Bucs don's reach/crack 81 this year, Hurdle is in trouble. If the Bucs start slow next year, Hurdle is in trouble. If the Bucs swoon after the break again (after a strong start), Hurdle is in trouble.

Unless Hurdle and the Bucs are a successful playoff team next year, Hurdle will find himself a victim of success.

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Rage, rage against the regression of the light.


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 Post subject: Re: Hurdle is a genius....
PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 12:24 am 
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Chris Anderson wrote:
No flaming away...but I would disagree. His inexplicable devotion to certain players despite their obvious failure to produce (in both standard and sabremetric indicators) is mind boggling. While there could be some argument about sticking with Clint Barmes because of his glove and the lack of depth at SS, there is NO valid argument to continue jogging Rod Barajas out there 4-5 times a week.


Couldn't agree more, Chris. On top of that, his in-game strategy is just mind boggling. He'd do well to hire a sharp strategic mind for a bench coach- and listen to him.

As for the Barajas-McKenry argument- McKenry is better in nearly every facet of the game. I think that the pitching staff as a whole has been ignoring the running game- either by a conscious decision or by plain old inability- hence why both C's have a low CS%. And you hit the nail right on the head when discussing CERA- of course McKenry's will be higher when you look at which catchers caught which pitchers.

McKenry is not a superstar. He is not even a top 10 catcher. But there is no rational argument to be made that he doesn't give the team a better chance to win when started in place of Rod Barajas. Ergo, choosing to start Barajas is not putting your team in the best position to win.


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